Talk:Luger pistol
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The section on Lugers being collectible items states..."All Luger pistols have collector value with some models, such as the "American Eagle" (having the eagle stamp over the chamber), being more desirable."I'm no collector, but why exactly is this more desirable? Is this a valid statement and not just a replica producer putting their brand name on he net? I might be missing the point, but I'd have thought an original would be more desirable than an American produced replica with incorrect markings. Anyone got any input on this?--79.72.166.168 23:08, 12 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]
What is the effective range for the Luger? --Ambassador Weyoun 03:13, 23 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Wikipedia's article about the 9x19mm Parabellum reveals nothing about it's maximum range, but I'd say it's very far as long as you're accurate enough. The problem is that at longer range, it's power is so low you'd need to be even more accurate. So at 600 yards you'd need to hit your target in the eye or in the neck to inflict lethal damage, as opposed to closer ranges where a shot in the chest could kill. At what range does the 9x19mm Parabellum round go subsonic? Generally bullet accuracy is diminished after it slows down past the sound barrier, since it's less stable. This could be helpful in calculating the maximum range of the P'08. | Phillip Bromley (Talk) 22:11, 16 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Currently there are seven pictures on this article one right after the other. This seems like too many considering that the article itself is fairly small. BigSciZot 19:15, 20 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]
What is the difference between a Luger and a Ruger. Is Luger the type of gun, while Ruger is a brand?
Ruger is a brand name , Luger is a model name and in fact made by different manufacturers like Mauser and Krieghoff. Modern manufacturers are Stoeger and indeed Ruger. The Luger was named P08 (Pistole 08) in the german army and P06 in the swiss army. Still the most used name for this kind/model/type of handgun is "Luger". —Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.84.171.1 (talk) 11:05, 14 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Georg Luger, an Austrian born in 1849, worked for DWM and made improvements to the older Borchardt pistol that came to informally bear his name.Bill Ruger, an American born in 1916, formed Sturm, Ruger & Company, an American gun manufacturing firm that is informally known as Ruger.No direct relationship at all. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.162.249.249 (talk) 03:57, 20 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
'Toggle lock' links to 'firearm actions', which contains no mention of toggle lock. Someone please edit it to include it. -Toptomcat 14:43, 2 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Styre rimfire scout RFR is described as using a "toggle lock" on numerous gun advertising sites - it's action is turned 90° & is a straight pull bolt action.Sure not automatic but may be a good reference Do.nosword (talk) 07:30, 15 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]
The title of this article should be Parabellum (pistol) or something similar, since that is the proper name of the gun. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.249.79.230 (talk) 20:44, 20 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Aofvilla is right! After the prototype stage the pistol hit the civil market under the name Parabellum in 1900 and was adopdet into military use first with the swiss in 1901 in the same form as the this civil model, the swiss called it "Pistole 1900". The german navy then had it´s "Pistole 04" and finally the german army the "Pistole 08". The Parabellum name also showed up in Georg Lugers Patent. The name Luger was first applied way after 1918 and was never offically used. Sure it was Georg Luger who invented the gun (or improved it from the Borchardt), but it was also him who gave it the name Parabellum.The pistol may be widely recognized as a "Luger" or "08", but that are inoffical terms. And the correct term "Parabellum" is at least as wide recognized.
The cartridges 7,65mm Parabellum (7,65x21) and 9mm Parabellum (9x19) got the Parabellum name because it´s the name of the gun in which they first appeared, and not the other way round!
This is all written mostly correct in the article, still the article title is incorret! Truedings (talk) 21:06, 14 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
This is probably a stupid question, but what is the function of the distinctive circular thing at the top rear of the weapon?--85.210.21.76 18:45, 6 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
What does "hot" mean in the following sentence?: "American 9 mm ammunition is nowhere near as hot as German military-spec ammunition"Could that be re-written for people unfamiliar with firearms jargon?—Preceding unsigned comment added by Jeffkw (talk • contribs)
Correct "a hot load" means a load with a relatively high pressure for the given caliber. (meaning more gunpowder in the cartridge than average)
It should be noted that AND TAKEN VERY SERIOUSLY that HOT LOADS DO NOT BELONG IN A WWII LUGER !Jamming / problems of feeding cartridges into the chamber has nothing to do with a "weak load". Those problem are related to cartridge length, overall length and bullet shape. Modern ammo is to be considered to strong for the old luger.
Sorry, but the preceeding remark is wholly incorrect. Most Luger jams are "stovepipes", i.e. caused by too low recoil force. 9mm Para ammo was loaded far hotter in pre-NATO days, often reaching 475 ft/lbs. A good, gunsmith-checked Luger will work far better with loads similar to those it has designed to handle- hotter then most contemporary commercial ammo. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.41.119.73 (talk) 18:20, 29 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]
As is the new preceding remark. The P08 has several common battering points, and therefore +P and/or heavy rounds should be avoided in favor of standard velocity 115gr jacketed ammo. Hardcast lead bullets should be avoided because the vast preponderance of Lugers have some bore damage, and they will "lead up" very quickly, producing a potential pressure hazard. Those wishing to shoot ther Lugers (I shoot my 1917 quite a lot), should swab the bore lightly with a patch soaked with Johnson's Paste Wax before a range session. This will improve accuracy and velocity while simultaneously reducing pressure. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 131.215.115.31 (talk) 19:15, 31 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]
I have to join in here for anybody who might read this: The germans loaded their 9mm ammo a little bit hotter starting in 1938. This lead to reliability problems with the parabellum pistol in WWII (which were incorrectly seen as an issue of an overly dirt sensitive gun and got the pistol a bad reputation. In fact no such problems seem to have occured in WWI with correct ammo) . Also modern 9mm Luger ammo is hotter than the original from before 1938. (I´m talking about standard 9x19, not +P!) This not only results in reliability issues but also to "teeth" marks when the toogle link hits the frame and it worns out the gun badly. 9mm Parabellum ammo is loaded a little bit lighter and is correct for the gun, although I´m not sure if all ammo manufactures comply to this nomenclature.
If you want to shoot your Parabellum Pistol, be sure to use correct light loaded ammo, if in doubt check with the manufacture, get deeper into the matter on various online forums, or load your own ammo! Or, if you want to shoot the usually cheaper and more powerfull modern loads, get a stronger recoil spring installed!
If your gun produces stovepipes with mild ammo it might have already a stronger recoil spring installed, then check if this really is the case!Truedings (talk) 21:38, 14 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I'm thinking this article should be renamed P08 Luger or Luger P08, as this is more correct and encyclopedic title than "Luger Pistol". Any objections? --Commander Zulu 09:55, 8 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
The name "Luger" was introduced and became popular in the United States. Historically, the rest of the world used the original name given by the manufacturer: Pistole Parabellum, commonly just Parabellum. The various P designations signify specific military models. e.g.: P.08 - Pistole 08 9mm 100mm barrel adopted by the German Army in 1908. P.04 - Pistole 04 9mm 150mm barrel adopted by the German Navy in 1904. etc. etc. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.100.196.74 (talk) 22:19, 23 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
The last comment is right, this should be renamed "Parabellum Pistol" Truedings (talk) 21:41, 14 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Shouldn't this be known as the P08. luger is a american term (sry if more western nations refered it to as luger) and this is a german gun. shouldn't it be refered to as the german name.p.s dont insult me and call me an idiot i make a valid point. --Esskater11 20:07, 21 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
After 10 years this still was not done. Georg Luger himself named and selled the gun as the "Parabellum Pistole", this term even is in his patent, and it is also the correct name for this article!
The term "Luger" first appeared way after 1918 in the US, ond this only in catalogues of an importer. It´s like calling every 1911, 1911A1 and civilian Colt Government the "Browning Pistol" Truedings (talk) 21:53, 14 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Hi:
In the final section, we begin with the phrase 'Although obsolete in many ways,' without explaining why this is so. I'm not a gun person, so I may be missing an obvious point here.
Andy —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.157.175.167 (talk) 05:14, 23 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Considering it's one of the most famous and expensive pistols of all time, I'm surprised it's not already in this article. Anyone care to draft something up? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.171.61.223 (talk) 08:04, 11 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]
While the page name lacks the period, the page text at present uses both forms, likewise the discussions above (whose conclusions re: nomenclature I fail to grasp, by the way). I would appreciate an authentication of the model name. -- Deborahjay (talk) 09:43, 3 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Could someone tell me where I can find a web page that shows how to take apart an 08 luger pistol? Thank youSilverfox61 (talk) 16:45, 24 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]
It was a Luger with a extra long barral.--LandonJaeger (talk) 18:47, 10 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
It says that it was used in the Chinese Civil War but how if the weapon was already considered obsolete and was no longer manufactured by the time of the Chinese Civil War. Anyone? --Coffeekid (talk) 04:48, 16 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
So was it produced from 1900 to 1943, or 1908 to 1945? Article is ambiguous on this point. Drutt (talk) 00:24, 13 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]
The article talks about .30 Lugers being produced commercially around 1923. An old Sears catalog shows them being sold to American civilians as early as 1908. Maybe I'm misunderstanding the sentence in "usage today." [1] Cite error: There are <ref>
tags on this page without content in them (see the help page). Mark in Iowa (talk) 04:51, 7 May 2014 (UTC)[reply]
The toggle action of the Luger is unusual; I don't know of any modern hand pistol that uses it. It would be interesting if someone could add pictures or diagrams of the gun in action, showing the toggle function.98.170.195.140 (talk) 00:12, 29 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]
The Luger on the photo is a Model 1900, impossible to be a copy of the later P 08. -- hmaag (talk) 10:34, 11 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I know a local gun shop in the USA that sells Luger artillery pistols, should this be added to users ? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 121.220.74.103 (talk) 09:40, 24 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
"(calibrated to 800 metres)" No way, guys! No fucking way! Maybe foot instead of meter, but even this would be no effective combat range for this kind of weapon/ammo.
It´s true, just look at pictures of the sights on google! Also the Mauser C96 had in some variants sights set up to 1200 meters. Don´t be fooled by modern standarts of ranges in personal defense situations. These guns had detachable shoulder stocks, so were basically carbines. Against a mass of enemy troops this could´ve made sense. In WWI rifle and MG fire was sometimes used indirectly like artillery, not necessarily to hit but just to surpress the enemy, why not do this with a shoulder stock pstol. Truedings (talk) 22:15, 14 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
The Navy modell uses a 6 inch barrel. The picutre shows a standard 4 inch barrel. The title P08 of the German Reichsmarine is therefore wrong or at least misleading 109.84.150.140 (talk) 15:08, 13 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]
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Some say George loved to play this game, but it can not be done with this gun. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 119.158.170.191 (talk) 09:49, 27 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I have amended the section references of barrel lengths in imperial inches. All Parabellum/Luger pistols were designed and manufactured using the metric system and this is the correct reference when discussing any dimensional features. (SM527RR (talk) 00:15, 16 November 2011 (UTC))[reply]
I have deleted the paragraph stating that Luger grips were only made of plastic and that wooden grips are an aftermarket replacement. This is complete nonsense. ALL Parabellum/Luger pistols, regardless of manufacturer, were produced with wooden grips until around 1940. At that time Mauser and Kreighoff began to use plastics until the end of production in 1944. I stand to be corrected on those exact dates by someone who is more expert on the WW2 models. (SM527RR (talk) 04:17, 11 January 2012 (UTC))[reply]
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Hello. I don't presume to be an expert on guns, (in fact I haven't fired one yet.) But does the P08 Luger have a more specific Rate of Fire than just Semi-Automatic? Let me know if I am wrong, but I have read about different semi-automatic guns and some do have different Rounds per Minute. (rpm) Am I wrong on this one? MKA — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.9.60.164 (talk) 15:09, 29 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]
The result of the move request was: moved to "Luger pistol". No comments defended the use of "P08" and most favored "Luger" as the common name. DrKiernan (talk) 16:22, 16 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Luger P08 pistol → Parabellum pistol –
The present article should be renamed as "Parabellum pistol" as the name whith what the pistol was patented by DWM is "Parabellum". Patent was registered when DWM was formed in 1897 when the company Deutsche Metallpatronenfabrik was fusioned with the Ludwig Loewe & Co.
"Luger" is a local USA denomination. The name "Luger" was introduced later by his dealer in the USA Hans Tauscher refering to the name of his designer Georg Luger (Santiago Tavella Madariaga, Armas y Tiro Nro 33, 1969 La pistola Parabellum).
"P08" is only the name of the 1908 9x19mm model and consequently does not represent all the different models referenced in the article either.
If indeed "Parabellum" comes from Si/se vis pacem, para bellum, then this should be present in the article, and sourced/referenced, of course. --Jerome Potts (talk) 16:23, 27 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]
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(help)What's missing is which was named that first: the cartridges, or the weapons? --Jerome Potts (talk) 18:32, 27 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Guys, the latin phrase "Si vis pacem, para bellum" is here since a long time (used by an ancient roman strategist first I think, but honestly not completly sure). Derived from this Georg Luger decided that "Parabellum" is a good marketing name. So it got the Parabellum-Pistol by definition of Georg Luger and Loewe/DWM, that´s also how it´s called in his patent. And it is the correct name to sum up all variations of that gun (commercial 1900, 1902, 1906; Swiss 1900, 1900/06, german P.04, P.08...) Although the very first one of Lugers prototypes was called "Borchardt-Luger" in 1894, the "Luger" name was not applied to any production model before an US importeur decided to do so in the late 1920´s or 1930´s when they begann to start exporting again after WWI.
Georg Luger redesigned the 7,65x25 Borchardt cartridge to 7,65x21 Parabellum, and this one later to 9mm Parabellum. Both for his pistol, in which those cartridges first appeared. So of course the cartridges got the name from the gun and not the other way round. It´s like .45 ACP where the ACP stands for Automatic Colt pistol, because that´s where this cartridge first apperead: In an Automatic Pistol made by Colt. Remember, back then everybody who designed a pistol also designed a cartridge for it, first because of marketing and selling not only the gun but also the fitting ammo, second because semiauto pistols were really a new thing and they experimented with all kinds of calibers. Heck even Mauser "stole" the 7,65 Borchardt and called it 7,63 Mauser for their Mauser C96. Truedings (talk) 22:56, 14 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Hello there!
I have been recently on Museo de Armas de La Nación Tte. Gral. Pablo Riccheri, Buenos Aires, Argentina. In which the weapons used by the three branches of the Armed Forces were displayed and I saw both the Mauser C96 and Luger pistol displayed too alongside several other german built pistols. Since I don't have any way to add a source I could leave the picture featuring the weapons I mentioned on the display case of the museum.
--190.175.40.6 (talk) 01:17, 26 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Does anyone here have information that can help to resolve whether it was a P06 or P08 that was used in the Annecy shooting? Currently they are referring to the P06, which a gun friend of mind has told me is very rare and quite unlikely. The question has been raised on their talk page Pmw57 (talk) 23:10, 9 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]
All the Lugers had a micrometer adjustable front sight, never heard about a micrometer adjustable rear sight. -- hmaag (talk) 11:24, 1 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
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Captured Luger's were much prized by Allied soldiers during both of the world wars as war trophies. However, during World War II, German soldiers were aware of this and would use Luger's as "bait", rigging them to detonate land mines or hidden booby traps when disturbed.I think: Luger's pistol was an evolution of the Borchard designed C 93; but capured Lugers were much prized.... -- hmaag (talk) 09:59, 13 January 2016 (UTC)[reply]
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The article contains this text "the U.S. Board of Ordnance purchased 1,000 Model 1900 Parabellum pistols with 4.75-inch barrels, marked with standard U.S. ordnance bomb proofs and "American Eagle" stamps over the chambers, "
The small stamps on early DWM Parabellum pistols that resemble a US Flame & Shell are actually a DWM in process inspection mark and not in any was related to the US test. the text should be revised to say "the U.S. Board of Ordnance purchased 1,000 Model 1900 Parabellum pistols with 4.75-inch barrels, marked "American Eagle" stamps over the chambers, " — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.100.196.74 (talk) 22:27, 23 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Is it a Single Action, Double Action / Single Action, or Double Action? Is there a safety, magazine release, decocker, etc? Strangely this information isn't found in this article.
Should there be some coverage of this? There were a tiny number of pre-war versions made, but also more by at least one post-war company.--Surv1v4l1st ╠Talk║Contribs╣ 20:21, 24 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Barrel does not move during reloading action!!Breach and toggle lock do not barrel it is screwed into the frame of the pistolDo.nosword@gmail.com 120.20.91.21 (talk) 15:48, 14 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]