Template talk:Did you know
There are currently 2 filled queues. Admin assistance in moving preps is requested.
This page is to nominate fresh articles to appear in the "Did you know" section on the Main Page with a "hook" (an interesting note). Nominations that have been approved are moved to a staging area and then promoted into the Queue. To update this page, it.
Count of DYK Hooks | ||
Section | # of Hooks | # Verified |
---|---|---|
May 10 | 1 | 1 |
May 12 | 1 | |
May 14 | 1 | 1 |
May 16 | 1 | |
May 17 | 2 | |
May 20 | 2 | |
May 21 | 2 | |
May 22 | 2 | |
May 26 | 1 | |
May 27 | 2 | |
May 28 | 1 | |
May 29 | 1 | |
May 30 | 2 | |
June 2 | 1 | |
June 3 | 2 | |
June 5 | 1 | 1 |
June 6 | 1 | |
June 7 | 2 | |
June 8 | 1 | |
June 9 | 3 | |
June 11 | 1 | |
June 12 | 4 | 3 |
June 13 | 6 | 5 |
June 14 | 2 | |
June 15 | 4 | 3 |
June 16 | 2 | 2 |
June 17 | 7 | 4 |
June 18 | 7 | 7 |
June 19 | 4 | 2 |
June 20 | 4 | 3 |
June 21 | 7 | 5 |
June 22 | 10 | 7 |
June 23 | 13 | 8 |
June 24 | 7 | |
June 25 | 10 | 8 |
June 26 | 10 | 4 |
June 27 | 5 | 4 |
June 28 | 9 | 3 |
June 29 | 6 | 3 |
June 30 | 9 | 4 |
July 1 | 12 | 5 |
July 2 | 5 | 3 |
July 3 | 13 | 5 |
July 4 | 8 | 2 |
July 5 | 11 | 6 |
July 6 | 14 | 3 |
July 7 | 9 | 2 |
July 8 | 7 | 1 |
July 9 | 1 | |
Total | 237 | 105 |
Last updated 10:42, 9 July 2024 UTC Current time is 10:48, 9 July 2024 UTC [refresh] |
Instructions for nominators
If this is your first nomination, please read the DYK rules before continuing. Further information can be found at the supplementary guidelines.
Frequently asked questions
How do I write an interesting hook?
Successful hooks tend to have several traits. Most importantly, they share a surprising or intriguing fact. They give readers enough context to understand the hook, but leave enough out to make them want to learn more. They are written for a general audience who has no prior knowledge of or interest in the topic area. Lastly, they are concise, and do not attempt to cover multiple facts or present information about the subject beyond what's needed to understand the hook.
When will my nomination be reviewed?
This page is often backlogged. As long as your submission is still on the page, it will stay there until an editor reviews it. Since editors are encouraged to review the oldest submissions first, it may take several weeks until your submission is reviewed. In the meantime, please consider reviewing another submission (not your own) to help reduce the backlog (see instructions below).
Where is my hook?
If you can't find the nomination you submitted to this nominations page, it may have been approved and is on the approved nominations page waiting to be promoted. It could also have been added to one of the prep areas, promoted from prep to a queue, or is on the main page.
If the nominated hook is in none of those places, then the nomination has probably been rejected. Such a rejection usually only occurs if it was at least a couple of weeks old and had unresolved issues for which any discussion had gone stale. If you think your nomination was unfairly rejected, you can query this on the DYK discussion page, but as a general rule such nominations will only be restored in exceptional circumstances.
Instructions for reviewers
Any editor who was not involved in writing/expanding or nominating an article may review it by checking to see that the article meets all the DYK criteria (long enough, new enough, no serious editorial or content issues) and the hook is cited. Editors may also alter the suggested hook to improve it, suggest new hooks, or even lend a hand and make edits to the article to which the hook applies so that the hook is supported and accurate. For a more detailed discussion of the DYK rules and review process see the supplementary guidelines and the WP:Did you know/Reviewing guide.
To post a comment or review on a DYK nomination, follow the steps outlined below:
- Look through this page, Template talk:Did you know, to find a nomination you would like to comment on.
- Click the "Review or comment" link at the top of the nomination. You will be taken to the nomination subpage.
- The top of the page includes a list of the DYK criteria. Check the article to ensure it meets all the relevant criteria.
- To indicate the result of the review (i.e., whether the nomination passes, fails, or needs some minor changes), leave a signed comment on the page. Please begin with one of the 5 review symbols that appear at the top of the edit screen, and then indicate all aspects of the article that you have reviewed; your comment should look something like the following:
If you are the first person to comment on the nomination, there will be a lineArticle length and age are fine, no copyvio or plagiarism concerns, reliable sources are used. But the hook needs to be shortened.
:* <!-- REPLACE THIS LINE TO WRITE FIRST COMMENT, KEEPING :* -->
showing you where you should put the comment. - Save the page.
- After the nomination is approved, a bot will automatically list the nomination page on Template talk:Did you know/Approved.
If there is any problem or concern about a nomination, please consider notifying the nominator by placing {{subst:DYKproblem|Article|header=yes|sig=yes}} on the nominator's talk page.
Advanced procedures
How to promote an accepted hook
At-a-glance instructions on how to promote an approved hook to a prep area |
---|
For more information, please see T:TDYK#How to promote an accepted hook. |
Handy copy sources:
To [[T:DYK/P1|Prep 1]]
To [[T:DYK/P2|Prep 2]]
To [[T:DYK/P3|Prep 3]]
To [[T:DYK/P4|Prep 4]]
To [[T:DYK/P5|Prep 5]]
To [[T:DYK/P6|Prep 6]]
To [[T:DYK/P7|Prep 7]]
How to remove a rejected hook
- Open the DYK nomination subpage of the hook you would like to remove. (It's best to wait several days after a reviewer has rejected the hook, just in case someone contests or the article undergoes a large change.)
- In the window where the DYK nomination subpage is open, replace the line
{{DYKsubpage
with{{subst:DYKsubpage
, and replace|passed=
with|passed=no
. Then save the page. This has the effect of wrapping up the discussion on the DYK nomination subpage in a blue archive box and stating that the nomination was unsuccessful, as well as adding the nomination to a category for archival purposes.
How to remove a hook from the prep areas or queue
- Edit the prep area or queue where the hook is and remove the hook and the credits associated with it.
- Go to the hook's nomination subpage (there should have been a link to it in the credits section).
- View the edit history for that page
- Go back to the last version before the edit where the hook was promoted, and revert to that version to make the nomination active again.
- Add a new icon on the nomination subpage to cancel the previous tick and leave a comment after it explaining that the hook was removed from the prep area or queue, and why, so that later reviewers are aware of this issue.
- Add a transclusion of the template back to this page so that reviewers can see it. It goes under the date that it was first created/expanded/listed as a GA. You may need to add back the day header for that date if it had been removed from this page.
- If you removed the hook from a queue, it is best to either replace it with another hook from one of the prep areas, or to leave a message at WT:DYK asking someone else to do so.
How to move a nomination subpage to a new name
- Don't; it should not ever be necessary, and will break some links which will later need to be repaired. Even if you change the title of the article, you don't need to move the nomination page.
Nominations
Older nominations
Articles created/expanded on May 12
Interstate 85 in North Carolina
- ... that I-85 switches directions from milemarker 96 to 102 in Davidson County?
- Source: [1]
- Reviewed:
- Comment: You're gonna have to zoom at least 75% into the map image to see the red line, which is I-85.
NoobThreePointOh (talk) 17:33, 12 May 2024 (UTC).
- It's not immediately obvious what you're talking about, and you should make it clear where this "Davidson County" place is for people who won't realize it's in North Carolina, USA. So ...
- ALT1: ... that for six miles (9.6 km) in Davidson County, North Carolina, traffic on I-85 drives on the left?
- I also wonder if you were able to find any explanation for this in your research. I think it's been noted elsewhere as the only significant place in the US with LHT. And maybe we should put that in the intro. Daniel Case (talk) 05:17, 14 May 2024 (UTC)
- Hmmm... I suppose that works. I'm just a little unsure about what hook exactly to choose. Yeah, I'll probably place it in the intro. NoobThreePointOh (talk) 09:12, 14 May 2024 (UTC)
Full review needed. Thanks. BlueMoonset (talk) 03:36, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
Let me review this. its new, long enough, QPQ not required,
but I don't see the fact that it drives on the left anywhere in the article. I used 'Ctrl+F' for left and can only find one mention, and that is not even about the direction.JuniperChill (talk) 12:41, 26 June 2024 (UTC)Actually, its there located just above Interstate_85_in_North_Carolina#Greensboro_to_Durham,its just worded slightly differently so I am giving it the go ahead. JuniperChill (talk) 12:46, 26 June 2024 (UTC)
Unpromoted. Pulled per Special:Diff/1232390332. Note this is the second time this hook has been pulled, so sending it back to unapproved to get a good hard look. RoySmith (talk) 14:22, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
- @Daniel Case: @BlueMoonset: @JuniperChill: For everyone here, this article had to be unpromoted from DYK due to the sourcing coming from Google Maps. After having found a much better source from NCDOT, which this article has a map, I'd like to get approval to see if it now meets the requirements for DYK. NoobThreePointOh (talk) 15:21, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
- (drive by comment) I don't think "drives on the left" is an accurate description of what happens here. Especially with the link, this seems to indicate that left-hand traffic rules apply (instead, all that happens is that the two directions cross over each other). If we had true left hand traffic, each direction should have its shoulder and most exits on the left hand side. —Kusma (talk) 16:08, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
- Yes, and honestly as per my previous comment IMHO we need an explicit source saying it drives on the left rather than just inferring that from a map when nobody else has noted it. As such, the switch from Google maps to a NCDOT map doesn't really address this central concern. The map still only sources that they two roads cross over each other twice, not that it's a "drive on the left" area. Somewhere like the United States Virgin Islands, on the other hand, it's clearly sourced that they drive on the left. — Amakuru (talk) 16:37, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
- Well, I guess I've given up on the DYK nomination then. All that effort I put in for nothing. NoobThreePointOh (talk) 16:49, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
- The reliability of GM is disputed, according to WP:RSP WP:GOOGLEMAPS. Its neither stated as reliable nor unreliable even after several discussions. But anyway It clearly shows that the I85 switches sides like a diverging diamond interchange without traffic lights. Since I am new to Wikipedia and DYK, I may as well leave it to another person to review/promote this hook. JuniperChill (talk) 19:53, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
- Yes, and honestly as per my previous comment IMHO we need an explicit source saying it drives on the left rather than just inferring that from a map when nobody else has noted it. As such, the switch from Google maps to a NCDOT map doesn't really address this central concern. The map still only sources that they two roads cross over each other twice, not that it's a "drive on the left" area. Somewhere like the United States Virgin Islands, on the other hand, it's clearly sourced that they drive on the left. — Amakuru (talk) 16:37, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
- (drive by comment) I don't think "drives on the left" is an accurate description of what happens here. Especially with the link, this seems to indicate that left-hand traffic rules apply (instead, all that happens is that the two directions cross over each other). If we had true left hand traffic, each direction should have its shoulder and most exits on the left hand side. —Kusma (talk) 16:08, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
@RoySmith, Daniel Case, NoobThreePointOh, and JuniperChill: FWIW there is an article here - [1] which discusses this in detail. I suppose it's questionable whether the "North Carolina Rabbit Hole" is a reliable source, but the guy does seem to have done his research and interviewed the road's designer and suchlike, so interested on opinions on that? — Amakuru (talk) 19:11, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
- Great find! I really like this concept of two rest stops in the middle that can be accessed by (normal) right exits. The author seems to be slightly more "independent journalist" than "blogger" but it isn't completely obvious why he passes our RS guidelines. If we trust his statement that there are almost no sources on this but do not trust his statement about the rest area, we won't be able to continue. —Kusma (talk) 19:47, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
- I started working my way through the article. To be honest, I have no idea how this passed GA; the sourcing is just abyssimal. For example, I'm looking at the first paragraph of "South Carolina to Charlotte". This entire paragraph is cited to map of Cleveland County which doesn't begin to say most of things the paragraph says. "from Cherokee County", as far as I can tell from the map, it's York County. "Most of the Interstate for its first few miles is generally rural in nature and remains four lanes." No clue how the map supports any of that. "which quietly merges onto I-85". Quietly? The map says quietly? "Interstate meets US 74 at a unique weave interchange" Unique? The maps says it's unique? "Both routes also enter Kings Mountain." Looking at the Google map, that does appear to be an accurate statement, but the cited NC DOT map certainly doesn't show it. But, to get to the matter at hand; the (supposedly) left-hand drive sections of I-85 The entire paragraph that contains this statement is cited to https://connect.ncdot.gov/resources/State-Mapping/Documents/thumbs/Davidson.pdf, which doesn't even come close to supporing almost anything in that paragraph. "The landscape becomes more rural"??? "I-85 enters a large forest with tree-lined medians"??? This really should have it's GA revoked as a defective review, but I just don't have the energy to file it. RoySmith (talk) 20:06, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
Articles created/expanded on May 16
Baubau
- ... that Baubau city filed two different budgets at the same time, resulting it to lose their chance at becoming capital of Southeast Sulawesi? Source: "Beberapa sebab terpilihnya Kota Kendari sebagai Ibukota Provinsi Sulawesi Tenggara di antaranyakalah jumlah suara pada saat pemilihan untuk penentuan ibukota. Selain itu,terjadi malbirokrasi di mana ada dinas di Kota Baubau yang mengajukan anggaran dua versi dan yang mengajukan dua orang, sehingga terjadi dualisme dalam satu dinas. Akibatnya,kekacauan dalam sistem birokrasi dan tata pemerintahan sangat mungkin terjadi jika Kota Baubau menjadi ibukota provinsi. Oleh karena itu, Mendagri dan Otonomi Daerah dalam keputusannya mengesahkan Kota Kendari sebagai Ibukota Provinsi Sulawesi Tenggara." Rabani, L. O., Purwanto, B., & Margana, S. (2020). Politik dan Ekonomi di Dua Kota: Baubau dan Kendari pada tahun 1950an–1960an. MOZAIK HUMANIORA, 20(1), 39–56. https://doi.org/10.20473/mozaik.v20i1.15746
- ALT1: ... that Baubau city has a fortress made out of coral reefs and limestones? Source: "Benteng Wolio dibangun dengan bahan baku berupa batu karang, pasir, dan kapur. Dalam sistem pengetahuan setempat, bahan perekat material benteng menggunakan putih telur ayam." https://books.google.co.id/books?id=HRHszgEACAAJ&newbks=0&hl=id&redir_esc=y (Page 49)
- Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/Minnesota State Highway 36
- Comment: Newly expanded 5 times, CE will be very appreciated thank you. Also special request to be posted on 29th July.
Nyanardsan (talk) 01:44, 16 May 2024 (UTC).
- Not a review, but special occasion requests for more than six weeks require consensus at WT:DYK. I'd also expect a more merciless prepbuilder to truncate ALT0 at 'time'.--Launchballer 18:33, 16 May 2024 (UTC)
- @Nyanardsan: Please complete a QPQ, and link it above. Thanks, Z1720 (talk) 02:11, 27 May 2024 (UTC)
- QPQ added. I also would like to highlight my request once again. I am fine if it must go through consensus at WT:DYK and any modification/ALTs are also fine as long as it mentions the city's name. Nyanardsan (talk) 03:26, 27 May 2024 (UTC)
- This is not a review but I would oppose the special occasion request. For one thing, the significance of the date is not even stated in the nomination, plus there is no mention of the date in the article. Thus it is not even clear what the significance of July 29 to the subject is. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 09:34, 14 June 2024 (UTC)
Full review needed. BlueMoonset (talk) 01:38, 19 June 2024 (UTC)
I am currently unable to check for close paraphrasing as Earwig is currently rate limited, so this is only a preliminary review. I can verify that a 5x expansion was completed within seven days of the nomination, and that a QPQ has been provided. I have a slight preference for ALT0, but as Launchballer suggested it will probably need copyediting. Both hooks are cited inline and cited to Indonesian sources; AGF although Google Translate seems to verify the information. A QPQ has been provided. The primary issue with the article right now is that it is in need of a copyedit. The article is inconsistent with its use of quotation marks (some statements use single ones and others use doubles) and there are multiple grammatical errors in the article, mostly missing uses of "the". Asking Launchballer for help in copyediting, but otherwise the article can't run until that is completed. As for the special occasion request, given that the article was nominated outside six weeks, it needed an IAR exemption at WT:DYK, but that did not happen. However, I would oppose such a special occasion request for that date as it is not mentioned anywhere in the article and its significance to the subject is unclear. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 01:35, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
- I'll take a look at this in the morning.--Launchballer 02:19, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
- I've added quite a few tags to this, and there may be more. I plan on giving this another pass, but this should take some of the edge off.--Launchballer 11:43, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
- @Nyanardsan: A few things; '98.45' is not a ratio; long strings of percentages such as the ones in Demographics would flow much better as a list; I found quite a few instances of claims being backed up by sources that can't possibly contain them, for example a 2022 source claiming something is as of 2023, and these will have to be remedied.--Launchballer 08:34, 4 July 2024 (UTC)
- For the ratio, I clarified again. I was simply following the statistics document like always, mentioning gender ratio in that way. I disagree with the demographics section should be converted to list, it is fine as it is as prose. The unclarified sources one have been fixed (I apologize, it's mostly me forgetting to recite BPS documents which is used a lot), except for the fish export one which is correctly cited already by AntaraNews article Nyanardsan (talk) 14:35, 4 July 2024 (UTC)
- Who described the Buton Sultanate's political position as "like a shuttlecock"? This should be in the article. Also, ratios show quantities relative to each another and are usually written in the form a:b.--Launchballer 16:07, 4 July 2024 (UTC)
- For the ratio, I clarified again. I was simply following the statistics document like always, mentioning gender ratio in that way. I disagree with the demographics section should be converted to list, it is fine as it is as prose. The unclarified sources one have been fixed (I apologize, it's mostly me forgetting to recite BPS documents which is used a lot), except for the fish export one which is correctly cited already by AntaraNews article Nyanardsan (talk) 14:35, 4 July 2024 (UTC)
- @Nyanardsan: A few things; '98.45' is not a ratio; long strings of percentages such as the ones in Demographics would flow much better as a list; I found quite a few instances of claims being backed up by sources that can't possibly contain them, for example a 2022 source claiming something is as of 2023, and these will have to be remedied.--Launchballer 08:34, 4 July 2024 (UTC)
- I've added quite a few tags to this, and there may be more. I plan on giving this another pass, but this should take some of the edge off.--Launchballer 11:43, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
- I'll take a look at this in the morning.--Launchballer 02:19, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
Articles created/expanded on May 17
South by South Lawn
... that the South by South Lawn festival, which took place October 3, 2016, was modelled after and "organized together with" the South by Southwest festival?
- Source: "It was the first – and you have to presume the last – South By South Lawn. Modeled upon and organized together with the original Austin, Texas, interactive festival South By Southwest, it brought a riot of color to the usually sedate seat of the US presidency." The Guardian
- ALT0a: ... that the South by South Lawn festival was modelled after and "organized together with" the South by Southwest festival?
- ALT1: ... that the South by South Lawn festival sign was programmed by Adam Savage and a team from Baltimore to illuminate every time someone made a social media post with the hashtag #sxsl? Source: "MythBusters’ Adam Savage and a team of makers from Baltimore made the giant letters “SXSL” that lit up every time someone posted to social media using the hasthag #sxsl. Artist Nathan Sawaya brought his Park People, sculptures of people made entirely of Legos." Smithsonian Magazine
ALT2: ... that the 2016 festival South by South Lawn was literally one of a kind? Source: One-off event. The Guardian- ALT3: ... that the 2016 festival South by South Lawn included a panel discussion on climate change led by President Obama and featuring actor Leonardo DiCaprio and Canadian climate scientist Katharine Hayhoe? Source: "The main event was a conversation, led by President Obama, on climate change with Leonardo DiCaprio and climate scientist Katharine Hayhoe. When talking about leaders taking on climate change, DiCaprio said, “I'm so very honored and pleased to be joined onstage with one of those leaders—a President who has done more to create solutions for the climate change crisis than any other in history—President Barack Obama.” Immediately following the discussion was the domestic premiere of DiCaprio’s new climate documentary, Before the Flood." Smithsonian Magazine
- Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/Wan Abubakar
TheSandDoctor Talk 00:46, 24 May 2024 (UTC).
- Hiya. The article was new enough at time of nomination (DYK nomination on 24 May, having been moved to the mainspace on the same day, and has not appeared on the Main Page) and is long enough (1737 characters of readable prose and is not a stub). ALTs 0, 1, and 3 are interesting, sourced, and formatted properly, though I would have reduced some of the detail (such as the dates) to increase intrigue. It is up to you if you want to retain the current level of detail (the character lengths are currently 154, 180, and 198 respectively, which are within policy but are pushing its boundaries). I am not approving ALT2: "one of a kind" is too broad and implies that there is something unique about the event, not that it occurred as a one-off.As the listed quid pro quo was used in a previous nomination, I believe that a new one is needed – my interpretation of
you must complete a full review of one other nomination (unrelated to you) for every subsequent article you nominate ... A review does not need to be successful to count as a QPQ
is that they cannot be reused even if the nomination is unsuccessful (maybe seek clarification at WT:DYK). Please also note that full reviews are needed to count as QPQs.With regards to core content policies such as copyright, neutrality, and BLP, I did not detect any violations (there is some close paraphrasing, such as the first sentence of the second paragraph of "Background", but there is a limited number of ways to say the same thing). However, there are some verifiability issues with the article:- I think that the basis for
initiated by the Obama administration
in that White House source is a little shaky; while it is probably true, it doesn't seem to be explicitly supported. - Is there a better source than that Forbes profile for Futurism helping to organise?
More than 20,000 attendees were invited
in the article ≠More than 20,000 were nominated
in the source.- General comment about the article (expressly not a DYK issue, more a bugbear): I don't really understand the citation structure – the frequency is very dense when it doesn't need to be (eg
technology and music[1] festival[2]
,one-day event[7] hosted on the White House South Lawn[8]
, andclimate[12] documentary Before the Flood.[13]
). You're free to ignore this comment if you wish. - Another general comment: if you want, there are some nice public-domain photos here that you can add.
- I think that the basis for
- As DYK eligibility requires additional work, I am marking the nomination with
. Please address these issues before I can approve this nomination. Sdrqaz (talk) 04:04, 20 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Sdrqaz: I never got a notification on my talk page from the usual bot about there being a problem here. Weird. The sub-heading of this White House page says that it is "A White House Festival of Ideas, Art, and Action". Does that help any? The Forbes entry is staff written, as are the Forbes 30 Under 30 picks, therefore falling under WP:FORBES rather than WP:FORBESCON. They're not explicitly mentioned in this staff article but if you follow the "media" link for that category of the 2017 30U30 present in the article, the profile is half way down the linked page. I don't think that that source should be a problem there. I have adjusted the 20,000 attendees line. Thanks for the link on public domain pics! I will go through those when I have some more time and add a few.
--TheSandDoctor Talk 15:55, 20 June 2024 (UTC)
- @TheSandDoctor: I don't think that there is a bot that notifies you if there are issues – it is up to the reviewer to leave such notices if they wish. I'll ping you to comments I make here instead, if that's okay. I did see that for the Obama administration issue; maybe I'm being too picky, so I'll leave it. I'll give you some time to find a full QPQ (see my comments at the start) or find clarification at
WT:QPQWT:DYK if you disagree. Would also like to hear your thoughts on the hooks. Sdrqaz (talk) 22:38, 20 June 2024 (UTC)- @Sdrqaz: Swapped out to Template:Did you know nominations/Wan Abubakar. My mistake re the bot -- I thought that there was one but clearly I'm mistaken. Pings are just fine! For ALT0 would
that the South by South Lawn festival was modelled after and "organized together with" the South by Southwest festival?
work? Would you suggest any detail reduction for ALT1? Curious what you had in mind for shortening ALT3; I think it is interesting enough as is but I feel creating a sense of intrigue could be improved, just not sure how. (Silly me thought I'd saved this comment last night but apparently not...) --TheSandDoctor Talk 14:53, 21 June 2024 (UTC)- @TheSandDoctor: That is an improved ALT0, in my opinion
. Take what I say with a grain of salt as hook-writing is not a precise science, but I would advise thinking about the purpose behind every included detail. As the author, it depends on what you want to highlight about the article. I would caution against writing hooks like sentences in normal articles: too much detail may not leave the reader wanting to know more.Part of the appeal for ALT1 as written is to attract readers who have heard of Adam Savage or MythBusters. However, there's also the risk that people get distracted by the link and click on him instead to find out more. The
team from Baltimore
may be extraneous detail if you take a more ruthless approach. For ALT3, the same consideration applies: if you wish to highlight the climate change element of it or Katherine Hayhoe's work, then inclusion of her article is a respectable decision. However, as above, it may lead to distraction: as DiCaprio and Obama are much more well-known, then it may not be necessary to have detail about her. Other ways to make it shorter could simply be just removing "actor" or "Canadian" etc.I will emphasise that these are just things to think about and you are absolutely free to disregard them as I will be approving the nomination either way. Sdrqaz (talk) 03:55, 23 June 2024 (UTC)- @TheSandDoctor and Sdrqaz: What is the status of this nomination? (For my money, ALT0 does not meet WP:DYKINT, ALT1 could drop 'was programmed by Adam Savage and a team from Baltimore' per WP:DYKTRIM, and ALT3's also cruising for a pruning, probably at 'Obama'.)--Launchballer 09:31, 1 July 2024 (UTC)
- Mainly waiting for TheSandDoctor's thoughts on the hooks. I don't disagree with you regarding ALT1 and ALT3, Launchballer, but am willing to defer to TSD if the purpose is to bring readers in through highlighting different information (see 2nd paragraph of 23 June comment). Sdrqaz (talk) 01:40, 4 July 2024 (UTC)
- @Sdrqaz and Launchballer: I will get back to this and am not intending to abandon or drop the ball here, but I have had a lot going on in the real world since then that I would rather not get into and won't be available until next week (so a few more days) most likely. Sorry. Just leaving this quick comment to make my intentions clear. I haven't forgotten, I am just at capacity in other areas right now that are eating up my time "irl"...
--TheSandDoctor Talk 13:18, 4 July 2024 (UTC)
- @Sdrqaz and Launchballer: My apologies for the delay. I cannot go into it here per se but it was unforeseeable circumstance wise. I would think that a good alt0 replacement would be "that the South by South Lawn festival was modelled after and "organized together with" the South by Southwest festival?", for alt1 I do think there is a strong appeal tying Adam Savage to it but he didn't do it alone so there is a valid point with just not including who did it at all. I concur that we can trim down to just Obama for ALT3. Thoughts? --TheSandDoctor Talk 04:05, 9 July 2024 (UTC)
- @Sdrqaz and Launchballer: I will get back to this and am not intending to abandon or drop the ball here, but I have had a lot going on in the real world since then that I would rather not get into and won't be available until next week (so a few more days) most likely. Sorry. Just leaving this quick comment to make my intentions clear. I haven't forgotten, I am just at capacity in other areas right now that are eating up my time "irl"...
- Mainly waiting for TheSandDoctor's thoughts on the hooks. I don't disagree with you regarding ALT1 and ALT3, Launchballer, but am willing to defer to TSD if the purpose is to bring readers in through highlighting different information (see 2nd paragraph of 23 June comment). Sdrqaz (talk) 01:40, 4 July 2024 (UTC)
- @TheSandDoctor and Sdrqaz: What is the status of this nomination? (For my money, ALT0 does not meet WP:DYKINT, ALT1 could drop 'was programmed by Adam Savage and a team from Baltimore' per WP:DYKTRIM, and ALT3's also cruising for a pruning, probably at 'Obama'.)--Launchballer 09:31, 1 July 2024 (UTC)
- @TheSandDoctor: That is an improved ALT0, in my opinion
- @Sdrqaz: Swapped out to Template:Did you know nominations/Wan Abubakar. My mistake re the bot -- I thought that there was one but clearly I'm mistaken. Pings are just fine! For ALT0 would
- @TheSandDoctor: I don't think that there is a bot that notifies you if there are issues – it is up to the reviewer to leave such notices if they wish. I'll ping you to comments I make here instead, if that's okay. I did see that for the Obama administration issue; maybe I'm being too picky, so I'll leave it. I'll give you some time to find a full QPQ (see my comments at the start) or find clarification at
- I still don't think ALT0 meets WP:DYKINT. It's not unusual for an event to be organised by multiple entities and even less unusual for it to be modelled after something. I haven't 'verified' either of the other hooks, but if you're asserting they're okay, then this can be ticked off. For pshaw, these are ALT1a: ... that the South by South Lawn festival sign was programmed to illuminate every time someone made a social media post with the hashtag #sxsl? and ALT3a: ... that the 2016 festival South by South Lawn included a panel discussion on climate change led by President Obama? (I do note that last month's most successful hook did not begin with 'that', so we could go with ALT1b: ... what the South by South Lawn festival sign did every time someone made a social media post with the hashtag #sxsl?)--Launchballer 07:32, 9 July 2024 (UTC)
Rashmika Mandanna
... that Rashmika Mandanna made her debut in 2016 opposite Rakshit Shetty in the Kannada romance Kirik Party?- Reviewed:
19Arham (talk) 21:24, 17 May 2024 (UTC).
A new hook is needed here as the hook may not be interesting or understandable to a broad audience, particularly if the reader is unfamiliar with Shetty. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 13:54, 20 May 2024 (UTC)
- @19Arham: Can you suggest some additional hooks below? Z1720 (talk) 02:10, 27 May 2024 (UTC)
ALT1: ... that Rashmika Mandanna starred in the third highest-grossing Indian film of 2023 opposite Bollywood royalty, Ranbir Kapoor?
- That doesn't seem to be much of an improvement, not to mention referring to Kapoor as "Bollywood royalty" could fall afoul of WP:WTA. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 02:20, 29 May 2024 (UTC)
- @19Arham: are there any other aspects of this article that could be a good hook? Proposing multiple hooks is more likely to get approved. @Narutolovehinata5: do you have any suggestions of interesting aspects in which to get a hook from? Z1720 (talk) 00:59, 10 June 2024 (UTC)
- I'm not an expert on Bollywood so I'm probably not the best person to ask about this; besides, I didn't get much ideas from a quick skim of the article, but it could just be due to unfamiliarity with the subject. Launchballer has experience proposing ALTs for entertainers so maybe they'd have some ideas. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 01:09, 10 June 2024 (UTC)
- ALT2: ... that Rashmika Mandanna was reluctant to accept her first Hindi cinema role as she disagreed with her character's views on spirituality? jumps out, although there may be others. Also @19Arham: I strongly recommend submitting an image with this nomination, as all of the images are Creative Commons.--Launchballer 20:23, 11 June 2024 (UTC)
- I'm not an expert on Bollywood so I'm probably not the best person to ask about this; besides, I didn't get much ideas from a quick skim of the article, but it could just be due to unfamiliarity with the subject. Launchballer has experience proposing ALTs for entertainers so maybe they'd have some ideas. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 01:09, 10 June 2024 (UTC)
- @19Arham: are there any other aspects of this article that could be a good hook? Proposing multiple hooks is more likely to get approved. @Narutolovehinata5: do you have any suggestions of interesting aspects in which to get a hook from? Z1720 (talk) 00:59, 10 June 2024 (UTC)
- That doesn't seem to be much of an improvement, not to mention referring to Kapoor as "Bollywood royalty" could fall afoul of WP:WTA. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 02:20, 29 May 2024 (UTC)
ALT2 sounds good and can be reviewed, though if anyone has additional hook suggestions that's also appreciated. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 11:02, 13 June 2024 (UTC)
- Actually, I'm fairly sure the whole article needs a review.--Launchballer 14:56, 29 June 2024 (UTC)
This is the oldest fully unreviewed nomination and I need a QPQ, so I'm reviewing. Long enough, just about new enough at nine days. Earwig highlights a few phrases, but these appear to come under WP:LIMITED. No QPQ needed. Reviewer needed to assess ALT2.--Launchballer 20:03, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
- Actually, I'm fairly sure the whole article needs a review.--Launchballer 14:56, 29 June 2024 (UTC)
Articles created/expanded on May 20
Jump (Tyla, Gunna, and Skillibeng song)
... that a fusion of international talent "Jump" by South African singer Tyla, American rapper Gunna and Jamaican singer as well as rapper Skillibeng is a collaborative song which blends Tyla's melodious vocals, Gunna's rap prowess, and Skillibeng's dancehall flair, marking a vibrant cross-genre collaboration that's making waves globally? Source: ' ' 'Source:' ' 'For 6 consecutive weeks, the song has maintained the number one position on the UK's biggest premier chart for afrobeats songs, which ranks them according to sales and streams over a 7 day period: [2]American rapper Gunna and South African singer Tyla traveled to Johannesburg, South Africa, Tyla's hometown, to film the official music video: [3]- Reviewed:
- Comment: "Jump" by Tyla, Gunna and Skillibeng achieved remarkable success, reaching the number 1 spot on The UK’s biggest Afrobeats songs chart for six consecutive weeks. The collaboration between American rapper Gunna , Jamaican musician Skillibeng and South African singer Tyla, filmed in Johannesburg, South Africa, showcases the global appeal and cross-cultural influence of contemporary music. The song's popularity underscores the growing recognition and appreciation of African music on an international scale. "Jump" exemplifies the fusion of diverse musical styles and talents, resulting in a chart-topping hit with widespread appeal. "Jump" has earned millions of streams and downloads worldwide since its release.
Qaqaamba (talk) 12:36, 20 May 2024 (UTC).
- Hooks should contain a bolded link to the article and be under 200 characters long, so I've struck it. Please propose something much shorter.--Launchballer 12:48, 20 May 2024 (UTC)
- ALT1: ... that "Jump" is a cross-genre collaboration blending South African singer Tyla's vocals, American rapper Gunna's trap, and Jamaican musician Skillibeng's dancehall? "Jump" stands out as the sole hip hop or trap and dancehall infused song on Tyla's eponymous debut studio album, Tyla. Qaqaamba (talk) 13:23, 20 May 2024 (UTC)
162 characters after adding an oxford comma, which I have added to the article title. Full review needed.--Launchballer 14:59, 20 May 2024 (UTC)
- ALT2: ... that "Jump" is a cross-genre collaboration blending singer Tyla's vocals, American rapper Gunna's rap and Jamaican musician Skillibeng's, dancehall? Qaqaamba (talk) 15:07, 20 May 2024 (UTC)
- ALT3:… that "Jump" was the only trap-infused recording on Tyla? dxneo (talk) 09:52, 24 May 2024 (UTC)
- @Qaqaamba and Dxneo: As per WP:DYKINT, the hook should be "perceived as unusual or intriguing by readers with no special knowledge or interest." Might I suggest something maybe to do with the "Haibo!" adlib, the famous Hillbrow Tower in the video, or perhaps the viral "they ain't never had a pretty girl from..." trend? —cybertrip👽 ( 💬 • 📝) 08:35, 28 May 2024 (UTC)
- @Qaqaamba, Dxneo, and Cybertrip: I was going to propose "that two of the places referenced in Tyla's "Jump" are the same place", except it doesn't check out to the cited source. Can this be remedied?--Launchballer 13:12, 28 June 2024 (UTC)
- Never mind, I added it myself.--Launchballer 10:04, 5 July 2024 (UTC)
- @Qaqaamba, Dxneo, and Cybertrip: I was going to propose "that two of the places referenced in Tyla's "Jump" are the same place", except it doesn't check out to the cited source. Can this be remedied?--Launchballer 13:12, 28 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Qaqaamba and Dxneo: As per WP:DYKINT, the hook should be "perceived as unusual or intriguing by readers with no special knowledge or interest." Might I suggest something maybe to do with the "Haibo!" adlib, the famous Hillbrow Tower in the video, or perhaps the viral "they ain't never had a pretty girl from..." trend? —cybertrip👽 ( 💬 • 📝) 08:35, 28 May 2024 (UTC)
- ALT3:… that "Jump" was the only trap-infused recording on Tyla? dxneo (talk) 09:52, 24 May 2024 (UTC)
- ALT1: ... that "Jump" is a cross-genre collaboration blending South African singer Tyla's vocals, American rapper Gunna's trap, and Jamaican musician Skillibeng's dancehall? "Jump" stands out as the sole hip hop or trap and dancehall infused song on Tyla's eponymous debut studio album, Tyla. Qaqaamba (talk) 13:23, 20 May 2024 (UTC)
Praetoria of Constantinople
- ... that in the Praetorium of Constantinople the brothers Theodorus and Theophanes (pictured) had twelve iambic verses branded on their forehead and torso?
- Source: Senina (2008), pp. 267-268
- Reviewed: Red Sea mangroves
- Comment: I will do the QPQ asap.
Alex2006 (talk) 16:11, 20 May 2024 (UTC).
- @Alessandro57: You still need to provide a QPQ as it has been over two weeks since the nomination. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 00:03, 5 June 2024 (UTC)
@Narutolovehinata5: you are right, sorry, QPQ done. Alex2006 (talk) 05:56, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
General: Article is new enough and long enough |
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Policy: Article is sourced, neutral, and free of copyright problems |
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Hook: Hook has been verified by provided inline citation |
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Image: Image is freely licensed, used in the article, and clear at 100px. |
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QPQ: Done. |
Overall: AGF on non-English sources, although was able to verify the basic facts elsewhere. Only concern would be the last sentence of the introduction: "At least two buildings with this function existed in the city". It is unclear if this is talking about jails, or places where the prefect dispensed justice. @Alessandro57: - Are you able to address this? CSJJ104 (talk) 16:28, 15 June 2024 (UTC)
You are right, @CSJJ104:, it wasn't clear, thanks. Updated everywhere with sources. Alex2006 (talk) 11:10, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Alessandro57: Reading this with the recent additions, is the article intended to cover both buildings, or just the one? If it's covering both then possibly it should be moved to Praetoria of Constantinople, otherwise the article should make clear which building it covers. CSJJ104 (talk) 12:49, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
Hallo @CSJJ104:, your concern has been addressed: article moved to plural. Cheers, Alex2006 (talk) 14:20, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
Performed a copyedit on the lead, but otherwise good to go. I assume good faith on the non-English sources. CSJJ104 (talk) 17:55, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
- Note that I've nominated the image for deletion. All that means is that this can't become the lead hook; no other issues. Schwede66 06:11, 1 July 2024 (UTC)
@Alessandro57 and CSJJ104: Senina 2008 pp.267–268 does not verify that the branding took place within the Praetoria, and as a translation of a primary source it is not a reliable source for the hook. Meanwhile, Janin 1950 is pushing the limits of WP:RSAGE, so unless it is watertight (could you please supply a quote that supports the hook) I think a new hook might be needed. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 16:06, 2 July 2024 (UTC)
- Also noting that the image was kept.--Launchballer 16:13, 2 July 2024 (UTC)
- @AirshipJungleman29: WP:RSAGE does not really apply here; this is a historical article, where the narrative part of history, which relies on medieval sources, is not liable to change much. The only developments could be the discovery and publication of major written sources or archaeological excavations, but the former hasn't been the case and the latter is unlikely to happen given that the sites lie at the heart of Istanbul, where only major infrastructure projects like the subway have led to extensive archaeological discoveries. In summary, Janin is still very much a WP:RS and valid for this topic, as can be seen by its still frequent use in 21st-century scholarly works. Constantine ✍ 10:09, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
- Cplakidas I trust your judgement re. RSAGE, but would still like to see a quote. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 10:11, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
- AirshipJungleman29 Thanks for pointing this out. I'm not actually able to access Senina 2008 and didn't notice the issue. Can I check though, is your objection purely to its use to cite the hook, or should the article also be updated? CSJJ104 (talk) 23:04, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
- Thanks a lot for your supplement of review and your comments, @AirshipJungleman29: , @CSJJ104: ,@Cplakidas:.Unfortunately I find myself since a week in the Poli and I have neither a PC with me(I am writing on a phone :-((() nor Janin (btw, for this article I have been forced to use the 1950 edition because the 1964 revised edition was borrowed by someone else). I agree with Constantine that for this kind of articles one has to rely heavily upon the primary sources, because it is all that we have. Anyway, I added another online secondary source to the text (Abschnitt V.17, unfortunately in German), and I hope that this will solve the problem. Cheers from Istanbul, Alex2006 (talk) 06:11, 7 July 2024 (UTC)
- AirshipJungleman29 Thanks for pointing this out. I'm not actually able to access Senina 2008 and didn't notice the issue. Can I check though, is your objection purely to its use to cite the hook, or should the article also be updated? CSJJ104 (talk) 23:04, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
- Cplakidas I trust your judgement re. RSAGE, but would still like to see a quote. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 10:11, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
- @AirshipJungleman29: WP:RSAGE does not really apply here; this is a historical article, where the narrative part of history, which relies on medieval sources, is not liable to change much. The only developments could be the discovery and publication of major written sources or archaeological excavations, but the former hasn't been the case and the latter is unlikely to happen given that the sites lie at the heart of Istanbul, where only major infrastructure projects like the subway have led to extensive archaeological discoveries. In summary, Janin is still very much a WP:RS and valid for this topic, as can be seen by its still frequent use in 21st-century scholarly works. Constantine ✍ 10:09, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
- Also noting that the image was kept.--Launchballer 16:13, 2 July 2024 (UTC)
- @Alessandro57: Reading this with the recent additions, is the article intended to cover both buildings, or just the one? If it's covering both then possibly it should be moved to Praetoria of Constantinople, otherwise the article should make clear which building it covers. CSJJ104 (talk) 12:49, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
Articles created/expanded on May 21
LS Power
- ... that LS Power has the largest non-utility owned energy storage portfolio in the United States, including pumped-storage hydroelectricity and lithium-ion battery storage?
AdJHu 胡 03:50, 22 May 2024 (UTC).
Article is long enough and created one day before DYK submission. It's copyvio free. It has an issue with sourcing, however; I marked citation needed on a whole paragraph that lacks citations. Personally, I also feel that the hook is very technical and wordy, and not particularly eye-catching to an outsider. In my opinion, I think the lithium ion battery facility fire in May 2024 is the most interesting thing in the article and would make the best hook. Kimikel (talk) 15:25, 28 June 2024 (UTC)
- AdJHu, are you intending to respond to this DYK any further? ♠PMC♠ (talk) 10:24, 5 July 2024 (UTC)
AdJHu hasn't edited since June 22nd and hasn't edited the article since May 24. If they return soon the nomination can continue, but otherwise this is marked for closure as stale unless someone decides to adopt it. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 14:41, 5 July 2024 (UTC)
Voluntary war
- ... that in the Israelite traditional laws of armed conflict it was permissible for a Jewish soldier to forcibly have marital relations with a beautiful woman who had been taken captive?
- ALT1: ... that in the Israelite traditional laws of armed conflict it was permissible for a Jewish soldier to rape and forcibly marry a beautiful woman who had been made a prisoner of war?
- Source: Eisenstein, Judah D. (1970). A Digest of Jewish Laws and Customs - in Alphabetical Order (Ozar Dinim u-Minhagim) (in Hebrew). Tel-Aviv: Ḥ. mo. l. pp. 228–229 (s.v. מלחמה). OCLC 54817857.; Babylonian Talmud, Kiddushin 21b–22a
- Reviewed:
Davidbena (talk) 04:30, 21 May 2024 (UTC).
- Drive by comment: "forcibly have marital relations" should either be changed to "rape and forcibly marry" or attributed to a source, this is far too euphemistic to have in Wikipedia's voice. Rusalkii (talk) 05:03, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
- Okay, I'll make the change, although I do think that it is a bit too strong.Davidbena (talk) 11:44, 29 May 2024 (UTC)
- Comment: I don't see how the word "rape" can be in the hook if it isn't in the article. I also think "traditional" may be misleading, unless they are still in effect or only recently stopped being active laws; if they haven't been in effect for hundreds or even thousands of years, then that should be clear as well. Note to Davidbena: rather than edit hooks in situ, please show any revised wordings as an alternate hook (i.e., ALT1, ALT2). I've done so to restore your original hook and show the requested revision as ALT1. Thanks. Also, don't forget to supply your QPQ review (see WP:QPQ); you're supposed to do so within seven days of nominating, and definitely within seven days of being reminded to do so. BlueMoonset (talk) 22:18, 9 June 2024 (UTC)
- @BlueMoonset:, thanks for your comment. Sometimes it is common practice among writers to use "euphemisms" in Belles-lettres and in prose, rather than use a word having the exact same meaning, but viewed as repugnant (e.g. "to forcibly have marital relations" instead of writing "to rape"). Would it help if I put, in the article, the word "rape" in parentheses, immediately following the words "to forcibly have marital relations"? If so, an alternate reading of the hook can be this:
- ALT2: ... that in the Israelite traditional laws of armed conflict it was permissible for a Jewish soldier to forcibly have marital relations with (i.e. rape) a beautiful woman who had been made a prisoner of war?
Done - Davidbena (talk) 22:25, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
- Alt3 (see below) is my preferred hook, as it clarifies everything. I will also go ahead and add "rape" in the main article. As for your question about use of the word "traditional," the word is still applicable today, since Jews in Israel recognize these ancient customs as being bona-fide Jewish traditions. They, in fact, could still be upheld today if we had an active Sanhedrin, which, in this case, we don't. Another option might simply be to write, instead of "traditional," the word "obsolete." This word, however, is tricky, because if the Sanhedrin were ever to be reinstated, these laws of warfare would still be applicable today. See, for example, Modern attempts to revive the Sanhedrin. Finally, I do not understand what you mean by saying that I must supply my QPQ review. Give me time to read-up on this.Davidbena (talk) 23:06, 9 June 2024 (UTC)
- To the best of my knowledge, I have nominated four articles on "Did you know...", and this present article, if accepted, will be my fifth. The rules in WP:QPQ state that if I've nominated 5 or more articles, only then would I be required to work on the nomination of another person's DYK. I take that to mean that I can begin doing that now. Okay, no problem.Davidbena (talk) 23:35, 9 June 2024 (UTC)
- @BlueMoonset:, I have begun the review process of the DYK article here.Davidbena (talk) 00:54, 10 June 2024 (UTC)
- @BlueMoonset:, thanks for your comment. Sometimes it is common practice among writers to use "euphemisms" in Belles-lettres and in prose, rather than use a word having the exact same meaning, but viewed as repugnant (e.g. "to forcibly have marital relations" instead of writing "to rape"). Would it help if I put, in the article, the word "rape" in parentheses, immediately following the words "to forcibly have marital relations"? If so, an alternate reading of the hook can be this:
- Comment: I don't see how the word "rape" can be in the hook if it isn't in the article. I also think "traditional" may be misleading, unless they are still in effect or only recently stopped being active laws; if they haven't been in effect for hundreds or even thousands of years, then that should be clear as well. Note to Davidbena: rather than edit hooks in situ, please show any revised wordings as an alternate hook (i.e., ALT1, ALT2). I've done so to restore your original hook and show the requested revision as ALT1. Thanks. Also, don't forget to supply your QPQ review (see WP:QPQ); you're supposed to do so within seven days of nominating, and definitely within seven days of being reminded to do so. BlueMoonset (talk) 22:18, 9 June 2024 (UTC)
- Okay, I'll make the change, although I do think that it is a bit too strong.Davidbena (talk) 11:44, 29 May 2024 (UTC)
- @BlueMoonset: and @Rusalkii:, this is to remind you that I have just concluded the work on another author's DYK (see Talk:Architects' Tombs), in order to qualify for approval of my own DYK. Hope that things can be expedited here.Davidbena (talk) 22:25, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
- ALT3: ... that in the Israelite traditional laws of armed conflict it was permissible for a Jewish soldier to rape and forcibly have marital relations with a beautiful woman who had been made a prisoner of war? The Talmud (Kiddushin 21b) calls this act a concession to man's evil inclination.
Full review needed now that QPQ has been submitted. BlueMoonset (talk) 14:57, 17 June 2024 (UTC)
- This feels like a walking time bomb and shouldn't be run. At least, as long as we're rejecting Template:Did you know nominations/Animal stereotypes of Jews in Palestinian discourse. theleekycauldron (talk • she/her) 16:53, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
- I, personally, would not draw a connection between the article that you mentioned above and this article, here, for the very reason that this article speaks about the laws of warfare in ancient Israel, at a time when there used to be a Sanhedrin. A brief reminder of Wikipedia guidelines for DYK state: "Successful hooks tend to have several traits. Most importantly, they share a surprising or intriguing fact. They give readers enough context to understand the hook, but leave enough out to make them want to learn more. They are written for a general audience who has no prior knowledge of or interest in the topic area" (End Quote). Davidbena (talk) 21:53, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
- It's certainly interesting – and as someone who was raised Orthodox Jewish herself, I'm well aware of the anachronism. Most people aren't, though, and at the end of the day, it's not about what's exactly said – it's about what message people think we're trying to send by choosing to run certain hooks. Sadly, I remain opposed to an otherwise fine-looking hook. theleekycauldron (talk • she/her) 04:41, 26 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Theleekycauldron:, would it at all help if we added the caveat that, according to Jewish law (Talmud, Sanhedrin 59a), the laws pertaining to a ‘beautiful captive woman’ apply only to the men of Israel, but do not apply to gentile soldiers? In this sense, women are still protected under the laws of the UN against rape and other forms of sexual violence committed by soldiers of the occupying forces (The Third Geneva Convention of 1949 [in Articles 13 to 16]).[1] While unto the men of Israel, the laws bequeathed to them by their forefathers are immutable,[2] without the Sanhedrin, this law would not apply today. And even when it did apply, the concession was made only after the fact that, in warfare, a soldier would have given vent to his passions anyway, whether he was allowed to do so or not, and the Torah wanted the men of Israel to be blameless, therefore, it excused the first act of passion. The conceptual-jurisprudential question that may be asked by students of International law is whether or not these laws pertain only to the inner circle of Jews when it comes to conquest by war, or can we say that these laws apply also to the Gentiles although they do not see themselves related to the Jewish law, as they have no access to it, nor do they have any say in the matter. In reply to this question the answer is, unequivocally, "No, they do not apply to non-Israelite armies". Davidbena (talk) 15:02, 26 June 2024 (UTC)
- It's certainly interesting – and as someone who was raised Orthodox Jewish herself, I'm well aware of the anachronism. Most people aren't, though, and at the end of the day, it's not about what's exactly said – it's about what message people think we're trying to send by choosing to run certain hooks. Sadly, I remain opposed to an otherwise fine-looking hook. theleekycauldron (talk • she/her) 04:41, 26 June 2024 (UTC)
- I, personally, would not draw a connection between the article that you mentioned above and this article, here, for the very reason that this article speaks about the laws of warfare in ancient Israel, at a time when there used to be a Sanhedrin. A brief reminder of Wikipedia guidelines for DYK state: "Successful hooks tend to have several traits. Most importantly, they share a surprising or intriguing fact. They give readers enough context to understand the hook, but leave enough out to make them want to learn more. They are written for a general audience who has no prior knowledge of or interest in the topic area" (End Quote). Davidbena (talk) 21:53, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
- This feels like a walking time bomb and shouldn't be run. At least, as long as we're rejecting Template:Did you know nominations/Animal stereotypes of Jews in Palestinian discourse. theleekycauldron (talk • she/her) 16:53, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
- @DYK admins: , Your views on this, please.Davidbena (talk) 18:21, 26 June 2024 (UTC)
- Considering current world-context, I think the hook is a no-go; if a less controversial hook could be found, that would be better. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 10:10, 28 June 2024 (UTC)
- @AirshipJungleman29: Okay, since that makes two people here that hold to that view, I would be willing to change the hook to read as follows:
- Considering current world-context, I think the hook is a no-go; if a less controversial hook could be found, that would be better. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 10:10, 28 June 2024 (UTC)
- ALT4: ... that in the Israelite traditional laws of armed conflict it was permissible for a religious Jewish soldier to abandon the Kosher dietary laws of the Jewish nation and to eat Terefah (non-Kosher foods) when engaged in warfare and there was Kosher food scarcity?
- Source: Eisenstein, Judah D. (1970). A Digest of Jewish Laws and Customs - in Alphabetical Order (Ozar Dinim u-Minhagim) (in Hebrew). Tel-Aviv: Ḥ. mo. l. pp. 228–229 (s.v. מלחמה). OCLC 54817857.; Maimonides (2016). Mishneh Torah by Moses Maimonides (Book of Shoftim) (in Hebrew). Vol. 14. Jerusalem; Bnei Brak: Shabse Frankel. p. 269 (Hil. Melekhim 8:1). OCLC 989980005.
-Davidbena (talk) 16:07, 28 June 2024 (UTC)
Far too long (see WP:DYK200) and rather repetitive. Also, parentheses aren't allowed in a hook. Significant trimming or a new hook needed. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 18:11, 28 June 2024 (UTC)
- @AirshipJungleman29:, Okay, I'll reword the hook. How does this one sound?
- ALT5: ... that in the Israelite traditional laws of armed conflict it was permissible for a Jewish soldier to abandon the Kosher dietary laws and to eat non-Kosher foods during war?
- Source: Eisenstein, Judah D. (1970). A Digest of Jewish Laws and Customs - in Alphabetical Order (Ozar Dinim u-Minhagim) (in Hebrew). Tel-Aviv: Ḥ. mo. l. pp. 228–229 (s.v. מלחמה). OCLC 54817857.; Maimonides (2016). Mishneh Torah by Moses Maimonides (Book of Shoftim) (in Hebrew). Vol. 14. Jerusalem; Bnei Brak: Shabse Frankel. p. 269 (Hil. Melekhim 8:1). OCLC 989980005.
-Davidbena (talk) 19:35, 29 June 2024 (UTC)
- How about adding some intrigue to this: ALT5a: ... that in certain circumstances Jewish soldiers may abandon Kosher dietary laws?--Launchballer 13:36, 1 July 2024 (UTC)
- @Launchballer:, Yes, of course, that is an excellent idea! People will click onto the link right away!Davidbena (talk) 23:28, 1 July 2024 (UTC)
- Are these the only circumstances in which abandoning the kosher laws is permitted? If not, the link becomes rather MOS:EGGy. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 16:59, 2 July 2024 (UTC)
- @AirshipJungleman29:, these are extenuating circumstances. The only other time when Jews can eat non-Kosher foods, including ordinary people that are not soldiers, is when they are faced with famine and if they do not eat the non-Kosher animal they would surely die of starvation. In all commandments a Jew may transgress in order to save his own life, except in three things: 1) to murder someone; 2) to worship idolatry; and 3) to engage in a forbidden sexual act.Davidbena (talk) 17:51, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
- Would ALT5b: ... that there is a circumstance in which Jewish soldiers may abandon Kosher dietary laws? solve the problem?--Launchballer 22:10, 2 July 2024 (UTC)
- @Launchballer:, Yes, that is a better way of wording it.Davidbena (talk) 17:54, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
- Are these the only circumstances in which abandoning the kosher laws is permitted? If not, the link becomes rather MOS:EGGy. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 16:59, 2 July 2024 (UTC)
- @Launchballer:, Yes, of course, that is an excellent idea! People will click onto the link right away!Davidbena (talk) 23:28, 1 July 2024 (UTC)
- How about adding some intrigue to this: ALT5a: ... that in certain circumstances Jewish soldiers may abandon Kosher dietary laws?--Launchballer 13:36, 1 July 2024 (UTC)
- I still prefer this DYK over all the rest:
- ALT6: ... that there is a circumstance in which it was permissible for Jewish soldiers to abandon the Kosher dietary laws and to eat non-Kosher foods?Davidbena (talk) 18:02, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
- Davidbena, ALT6 only works if it is no longer permissible today under any circumstances. Also, the hook wording is a bit convoluted and unnecessarily lengthy. BlueMoonset (talk) 04:46, 9 July 2024 (UTC)
- What is your opinion of ALT5b BlueMoonset?--Launchballer 08:00, 9 July 2024 (UTC)
- Davidbena, ALT6 only works if it is no longer permissible today under any circumstances. Also, the hook wording is a bit convoluted and unnecessarily lengthy. BlueMoonset (talk) 04:46, 9 July 2024 (UTC)
- ALT6: ... that there is a circumstance in which it was permissible for Jewish soldiers to abandon the Kosher dietary laws and to eat non-Kosher foods?Davidbena (talk) 18:02, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
Articles created/expanded on May 22
Khirbet el-Qutt
- ... that hiding complexes from the Bar Kokhba revolt were found in Khirbet el-Qutt and other places in ancient Samaria?
- Source: "Khirbet el-Qutt -A Fortified Jewish Village in Southern Samaria from the Second Temple Period and the Bar Kokhba Revolt"; "Jewish Settlement in the Toparchy of Acraba during the Second Temple Period - The Archaeological Evidence". Judea and Samaria Research Studies8. 18: 177–200 – via academia.edu; "תולדות היישוב בהר שומרון בתקופה הרומית־ביזנטית". kotar.cet.ac.il. Retrieved 2024-05-21.
- Reviewed:
Owenglyndur (talk) 13:48, 22 May 2024 (UTC).
- I have begun the review process of this DYK, and the hook seems good and accurate, based on the sources cited. The article is also new enough, having been created on 21 May 2024.
Article length and age are fine; no copyright violations or plagiarism concerns; reliable sources are used. The article, however, can be improved by using the common spelling "archaeological" (instead of "archeological"). This will bring uniformity in spelling, as, currently, both spellings are used in the article.Davidbena (talk) 00:50, 10 June 2024 (UTC)
- A suggested improvement might be to add the word "underground" in the hook, even though the link explains what is meant by "hiding complexes." Most editors will not click onto the link, and therefore it is helpful to add this clarification at the very outset. For example, ALT1 ... that underground hiding complexes from the Bar Kokhba revolt were found in Khirbet el-Qutt and other places in ancient Samaria? (End Quote).Davidbena (talk) 01:04, 10 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Davidbena: I just removed a copyright violation from the article and will be asking for the effected revisions to be deleted. I have not yet check the rest of the article, but given a COPYVIO issue here and on other articles by User:OwenGlyndur (see the revision history of Ein Gedi synagogue and Ein Gedi archaeological site) I recommend that this nomination should be declined until we are confident that the remainder of this article does not breach WP:COPYVIO. Richard Nevell (talk) 19:35, 10 June 2024 (UTC)
- Agreed. I overlooked the copyright violation. If the creator of this article wishes to rewrite (paraphrase) the sections that he plagiarized, there can be some redress to what was done.Davidbena (talk) 21:42, 10 June 2024 (UTC)
Note that after the recent copyvio deletions, the article at 1335 prose characters is too short to qualify for DYK (1500 prose character minimum). If it hasn't been expanded sufficiently within seven days, it should be marked as unsuccessful. BlueMoonset (talk) 03:00, 13 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Owenglyndur: Have you addressed the above? Z1720 (talk) 15:21, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
@Owenglyndur: This is currently above 1500 characters, however there are currently multiple maintenance templates within the article and these need rectifying.--Launchballer 08:59, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Launchballer:I have addresses you comments Owenglyndur (talk) 08:15, 1 July 2024 (UTC)
Fine by me. I'm not seeing 'and other places' in the article and I'd probably lose both it and 'from the Bar Kokhba revolt' per WP:DYKTRIM. The rest would need an end-of-sentence citation.--Launchballer 08:44, 1 July 2024 (UTC)
- @Launchballer:I have addresses you comments Owenglyndur (talk) 08:15, 1 July 2024 (UTC)
- Agreed. I overlooked the copyright violation. If the creator of this article wishes to rewrite (paraphrase) the sections that he plagiarized, there can be some redress to what was done.Davidbena (talk) 21:42, 10 June 2024 (UTC)
I'm really excited about the opening of the Tuen Ma line
- ... that a train enthusiast was so excited about the opening of the Tuen Ma line that he sang about it?
- ALT1: ... that on this day three years ago, someone was really excited about the opening of Tuen Ma line? Source: SCMPMing Pao
- Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/REM de l'Est
- Comment: I'd like to request for the date to be June 27th since that day is the third anniversary of the opening of the line and the third anniversary of the phrase being said.
On another note, as I will be going to China from tomorrow until the 30th, and as most will know Wikipedia can't be used in China, I'd appreciate some patience if I don't answer until after that date. I might use roaming to make minor edits or answer some questions before then, but I likely won't make any large-scale edits until after.
S5A-0043Talk 08:51, 22 May 2024 (UTC).
- Comment (not a full review). Per the spirit of WP:BLP, I do not think an article about an autistic boy who became an internet meme is suitable for the Main Page, especially if the full name is mentioned. (The original media reports used 羅先生 (Mr. Law) or 羅同學 (Classmate Law); I do not know when and which HK media started using the full name). The article itself mentions doxxing and negative attention; posting on our Main Page has the potential to lead to further harm. I would suggest not to post this without clear consensus otherwise from a place like the BLP noticeboard. —Kusma (talk) 16:07, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
- @Valereee and Kusma: I'll consolidate my response over here so as not to split the discussion too much and cause any confusion. For the person name, while the person is indeed referred as 羅同學 or 羅先生 a lot in Chinese media, the ones I found in English (SCMP and The Standard in particular) refer to the person by the full name Jason Law: [4][5][6][7]. In fact The Standard included the romanization of 哲琛 as well, but I decided against including it since it isn't really a critical detail in this case. My reasoning for the usage of the full name is based on WP:COMMONNAME, which states that we "generally prefer the name that is most commonly used (as determined by its prevalence in a significant majority of independent, reliable, English-language sources" (emphasis added in italics). Yes this isn't an article title but nonetheless since "Mr Law" or "Classmate Law" isn't as widespread in English I don't think it'll be helpful in this case.
I'm not opposed to a discussion on WP:BLPN or somewhere else, but respectfully I'm not sure whether it still matters. As in, it's been three years since the phrase was first said. During these three years, not only has the person made further appearences and interviews [8][9], he has even appeared in an official MTR video re-enacting the scene [10][11]. I'm very sympathetic to his experience of being doxxed, but I genuinely think that given the time passage it isn't particularly as big of a deal as we may think. Him opening up about being doxxed was in 2021; he is still making appearences thanks to the notability from this phrase in 2022. If there was so much of a worry, he could've rejected any further publicity and we wouldn't be seeing him in the MTR video. In addition, there's been far less coverage about the doxxing as far as I can find compared to the more positive aspects, meaning most media (and in turn WP:RSes) don't think this is an important aspect to cover either. I hope I summed up my perspective well enough, and I'm open to any objections.
Regarding a possible merge as suggested on WT:DYK, my opinion would be oppose. The article easily passes WP:GNG with the number of sources covering the subject, and the MTR video shows that it still has a lasting effect even one year later. Plus, I'm not sure how the article can be merged. I already had a hard time finding articles to link to my article on existing content, and (at least for me) it's quite tough to add details of this event into other articles. S5A-0043Talk 02:28, 31 May 2024 (UTC)
- @Valereee and Kusma: I'll consolidate my response over here so as not to split the discussion too much and cause any confusion. For the person name, while the person is indeed referred as 羅同學 or 羅先生 a lot in Chinese media, the ones I found in English (SCMP and The Standard in particular) refer to the person by the full name Jason Law: [4][5][6][7]. In fact The Standard included the romanization of 哲琛 as well, but I decided against including it since it isn't really a critical detail in this case. My reasoning for the usage of the full name is based on WP:COMMONNAME, which states that we "generally prefer the name that is most commonly used (as determined by its prevalence in a significant majority of independent, reliable, English-language sources" (emphasis added in italics). Yes this isn't an article title but nonetheless since "Mr Law" or "Classmate Law" isn't as widespread in English I don't think it'll be helpful in this case.
- I find it difficult to judge whether he really embraces his popularity. His YouTube just looks like railfan stuff not trying to profit from his viral appearance. Happy to hear other opinions. —Kusma (talk) 09:10, 31 May 2024 (UTC)
- Seems like he's talked to reporters, so he's not shy about coverage – but this has to be an NEVENT fail, right? theleekycauldron (talk • she/her) 02:11, 17 June 2024 (UTC)
- oh, maybe not. hm... i do think this would be better merged, but if we go through with this, let's be kind to the guy. theleekycauldron (talk • she/her) 02:13, 17 June 2024 (UTC)
- I find it difficult to judge whether he really embraces his popularity. His YouTube just looks like railfan stuff not trying to profit from his viral appearance. Happy to hear other opinions. —Kusma (talk) 09:10, 31 May 2024 (UTC)
- Given the concerns about whether or not the article meets BLP and the notability guidelines, along with how this still hasn't gotten an actual review despite being open for over a month, I wonder if it would be for the best to just reject this nomination as a bad fit for DYK. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 13:03, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
Actually, I'm just going ahead and marking this for closure due to a lack of review, which suggests that editors are reluctant to touch it over its content and context. Probably for the best. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 13:28, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
- To be fair, the only reason I haven't reviewed this is because I strictly review oldest first and there are a few ahead of this. I'd be wanting a very strong rationale as to why this article should stay up given WP:MPJI, especially given that a common facet of autism is an impaired sense of danger awareness - perhaps I'm extrapolating from mine but he may very well have not realised 'doing this will attract further odium'.--Launchballer 09:48, 4 July 2024 (UTC)
Articles created/expanded on May 26
Yang Jingru (speed skater)
- ... that speed skater Yang Jingru is the first Chinese gold medalist at the 2024 Winter Youth Olympics in Gangwon, South Korea?
- Source: 首金!杨婧茹获冬青奥会短道速滑女子1500米金牌
- ALT1: ... that during the 2024 Winter Youth Olympics, Chinese speed skater Yang Jingru and her teammate used 'rabbit tactic', which the TikTok account of the International Olympic Committee praised as an 'incredible strategy'? Source: Chinese teenage skaters' "rabbit tactic" goes viral - Xinhua
- ALT2: ... that Chinese speed skater Yang Jingru and her teammate's performance at the 1500 metres short speed skating in the 2024 Winter Youth Olympics was considered a 'genius trick'? Source: https://www.foxsports.com.au/olympics/better-than-bradbury-fans-melt-down-over-most-genius-trick-olympics-have-ever-seen/news-story/1897d6e4bf4078f7a30d66ed5f6fbfb3
- Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/Larrabee County, Iowa
Toadboy123 (talk) 11:35, 26 May 2024 (UTC).
I have some sourcing concerns on this new enough and large enough expansion. I have to AGF on the Chinese-language sourcing.
- Can we say that "the IOC" praised it as "genius" when their TikTok account did?
- The Fox Sports Australia piece is similarly fluffy/listicle-y. The "genius trick" item was actually in SB Nation here, and we should replace Fox Sports Australia with the original source.
- I'd like to see these issues addressed. Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 20:15, 26 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Toadboy123: Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 20:16, 26 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Sammi Brie: I have made modifications as per the issues you stated: 1. updated the ALT1 hook to state that TikTok account mentioned it as such. 2. Updated the link by replacing Fox News with SB Nation. Let me know if its good to go now. Toadboy123 (talk) 03:50, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
- Sammi Brie, this needs your attention. Schwede66 03:49, 5 July 2024 (UTC)
I just can't get over us putting a quote from the IOC's TikTok on the Main Page. Apologies to Schwede66—I had drafted a message, but I have had an intense last week-plus, and somehow it just slipped through the cracks. Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 21:12, 8 July 2024 (UTC)
- @Toadboy123: Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 20:16, 26 June 2024 (UTC)
![](http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5c/Olympic_rings_without_rims.svg/50px-Olympic_rings_without_rims.svg.png)
Articles created/expanded on May 27
Kaur (short film)
- ... that in the British short film Kaur, a Sikh father does not approve of his daughter wearing a turban?
- Source: ""Kaur" told the story of a Sikh woman who chose to defy her father's wishes by wearing a turban."...[12]
- Reviewed: William Post
- Comment: Still have a bit more work to do on it
Whispyhistory (talk) 05:57, 3 June 2024 (UTC).
A new hook has to be proposed as the current one does not meet WP:DYKFICTION. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 11:47, 5 June 2024 (UTC)
- ALT1... that the British short film Kaur (2022), toured Gurudwaras, festivals and universities in the UK before appearing on ITVX, BritBox and then Netflix? Whispyhistory (talk) 06:22, 7 June 2024 (UTC)
- I'm still not so sure if this works either. @Launchballer: What do you think? Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 10:26, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
- Parentheses aren't allowed per WP:DYK200, and I think 'ITVX, Britbox and then Netflix' is pure namedropping (and it should really be 'Britbox, and'). I'll take a look when I get back, but I'd be inclined to take a rewritten version of ALT1, like so: ALT1a: ... that prior to appearing on video-on-demand services, the 2022 short film Kaur had toured festivals, universities, and gurdwaras? Also, is there a difference between 'gurdwara' and 'gurudwara'?--Launchballer 11:25, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
- I just had a flick through the references. Per ref #3, there's a hook in some variant of ... that Dr Parvinder Shergill became so fed up of waiting for another film to be led by a Sikh woman that she co-wrote and co-produced her own?.--Launchballer 14:42, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
- Thank you both... I'll work on it... sounds good. Whispyhistory (talk) 16:13, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
- I just had a flick through the references. Per ref #3, there's a hook in some variant of ... that Dr Parvinder Shergill became so fed up of waiting for another film to be led by a Sikh woman that she co-wrote and co-produced her own?.--Launchballer 14:42, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
- Parentheses aren't allowed per WP:DYK200, and I think 'ITVX, Britbox and then Netflix' is pure namedropping (and it should really be 'Britbox, and'). I'll take a look when I get back, but I'd be inclined to take a rewritten version of ALT1, like so: ALT1a: ... that prior to appearing on video-on-demand services, the 2022 short film Kaur had toured festivals, universities, and gurdwaras? Also, is there a difference between 'gurdwara' and 'gurudwara'?--Launchballer 11:25, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
- I'm still not so sure if this works either. @Launchballer: What do you think? Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 10:26, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
- ALT2... that British Sikh physician Parvinder Shergill could not find a recent mainstream English film led by a woman that looked like her so she co-wrote and co-produced her own?Actor, writer and producer Parvinder Shergill...she's had to wait too long to see movies featuring women who look like her....Bend it like Beckham, 20 years ago, was the last mainstream film to feature women from her background...She co-wrote and co-produced it ...[13][14] Whispyhistory (talk) 13:59, 17 June 2024 (UTC)
- Reads a bit breathless. I'm going to suggest:
- ALT2a... that after British Sikh physician Parvinder Shergill could not find a recent mainstream English film led by a woman that looked like her, she co-wrote and co-produced her own?
...and call for a full reviewer.--Launchballer 21:10, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
Croton alabamensis
- ... that the Alabama croton is related to plants found in Cuba and is cultivated at the Mt. Cuba Center in Delaware?
- Source: X, 1034436770698604544: "Alabama croton, with its silvery undersides on its foliage, balances out this late summer arrangement. Croton alabamensis var. alabamensis is found in the wild in just a few counties in Alabama. We have some specimens planted along our Main Drive,", "C. alabamensis emerges alone on a long branch that is sister to Croton section Corylocroton and the Cuban endemic genus Moacroton", Molecular Ecology (2006) 15, 2735–2751
- ALT1: ... that the two varieties of Alabama croton are separated by more than 1,000 kilometres (620 mi)? Source: "In a surprising discovery in 1989, C. alabamensis was found in central Texas, more than 1000 km from the Alabama populations" Molecular Ecology (2006) 15, 2735–2751
- Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/Drew Thomas
TDogg310 (talk) 00:00, 2 June 2024 (UTC).
General: Article is new enough and long enough |
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Policy: Article is sourced, neutral, and free of copyright problems |
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|
Hook eligibility:
- Cited:
- For ALT0, Twitter/X is generally not a reliable source, and the other citation for the plant being at the Mt. Cuba Center in the article fails verification. For ALT1, the source given in the nomination is different to the one in the article (Southwestern Rare and Endangered Plants Proceedings of the Second Conference), and both are offline so I can't check.
- Interesting:
Image: Image is freely licensed, used in the article, and clear at 100px. |
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|
QPQ: None required. |
Overall: Thanks for doing a QPQ even though you didn't have to! The one problem is the hook citing - due to the citation given for ALT1 being different to the one used for that fact in the article with both being offline, I don't think I can give this an AGF pass. If you either add the Molecular Ecology source to the statement in the article or provide the relevant quote from Southwestern Rare and Endangered Plants Proceedings of the Second Conference, I think I can pass ALT1 (but not ALT0). Suntooooth, it/he (talk/contribs) 02:04, 26 June 2024 (UTC)
Articles created/expanded on May 28
List of historic places in Kaikōura District
- ... that carpenter Cumming "Cum" Haswell erected a historic villa, later described as "modestly-scaled but ornamental"?
Generalissima (talk) (it/she) 22:43, 28 May 2024 (UTC).
General: Article is new enough and long enough |
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Policy: Article is sourced, neutral, and free of copyright problems |
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|
Hook eligibility:
- Cited:
- Interesting:
- perhaps state that Haswell was a carpenter, as he could have just been the owner?
QPQ: Done. |
Overall: Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 08:17, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Peacemaker67: Oops, didn't see this until now. Generalissima (talk) (it/she) 21:40, 8 July 2024 (UTC)
Articles created/expanded on May 29
Rhapsody (climb)
... that when first climbed in 2006, Rhapsody became the first-ever E11-graded traditional rock climbing route?
- Reviewed:
Aszx5000 (talk) 19:20, 2 June 2024 (UTC).
Not really sure if this particular hook fact or wording is the best option here. It's really reliant on specialist information, specifically a grade of rock climbing that isn't even a universal or international one. My suggestion would be, if possible, to propose a hook that could be easily understood even by non-rock climbers. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 14:18, 3 June 2024 (UTC)
- How about "... that when first climbed in 2006, Rhapsody was the hardest traditional climbing route in the world?", with sourcing here Last year he succeeded in making what is generally recognised as the world's hardest 'traditional' climb, Rhapsody, on Dumbarton Rock from the BBC, and Rhapsody is officially known as the world's hardest traditional rock climb from Telegraph. Aszx5000 (talk) 15:14, 3 June 2024 (UTC)
That's a much better hook. This is ready for a full review. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 22:28, 3 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Narutolovehinata5: I am doing a GA review of this article. If passed, I would recommend passing the DYK hook as well. xq 11:42, 15 June 2024 (UTC)
- 48JCL, please note that the GA reviewer may not also review the DYK nomination. Different reviewers are required per DYK rules. Thanks. BlueMoonset (talk) 02:18, 19 June 2024 (UTC)
- @BlueMoonset: sorry, that is not what I meant for my comment to go for. I meant to say that a spotcheck was not needed as I did one in the GAR. 48JCL 13:49, 21 June 2024 (UTC)
- 48JCL, even so, that's still not appropriate. The DYK reviewer needs to do their own checking independent of the GA review, and should take nothing for granted by the fact that it achieved GA status or that some other reviewer approved parts of its review. There have been some GAs that ended up being delisted based on significant issues found by the subsequent DYK reviewer. BlueMoonset (talk) 15:44, 23 June 2024 (UTC)
- @BlueMoonset: sorry, that is not what I meant for my comment to go for. I meant to say that a spotcheck was not needed as I did one in the GAR. 48JCL 13:49, 21 June 2024 (UTC)
- 48JCL, please note that the GA reviewer may not also review the DYK nomination. Different reviewers are required per DYK rules. Thanks. BlueMoonset (talk) 02:18, 19 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Narutolovehinata5: I am doing a GA review of this article. If passed, I would recommend passing the DYK hook as well. xq 11:42, 15 June 2024 (UTC)
- How about "... that when first climbed in 2006, Rhapsody was the hardest traditional climbing route in the world?", with sourcing here Last year he succeeded in making what is generally recognised as the world's hardest 'traditional' climb, Rhapsody, on Dumbarton Rock from the BBC, and Rhapsody is officially known as the world's hardest traditional rock climb from Telegraph. Aszx5000 (talk) 15:14, 3 June 2024 (UTC)
Full review needed now that new hook has been submitted. BlueMoonset (talk) 21:51, 4 July 2024 (UTC)
Articles created/expanded on May 30
Felix Eberty
- ... that the 1846 book The Stars and World History by Felix Eberty, which contemplated a faraway observer seeing "the earth at this moment as it existed at the time of Abraham", inspired a young Albert Einstein?
- Source: "By the time that Felix Eberty, a German jurist and amateur astronomer, anonymously published “The Stars and World History,” in 1846, it was well known that light had a finite speed... Eberty was particularly fascinated by what this delay meant for a faraway observer of our planet. Perched on a distant star, he wrote, such a person might “see the earth at this moment as it existed at the time of Abraham.” Furthermore, by hopscotching across the cosmos, “he will be able to represent to himself, as rapidly as he pleases, that moment in the world’s history which he wishes to observe at leisure.” Eberty had witnessed great gains in the speed of transportation and communication during his lifetime, and he believed that humanity might soon be travelling even faster than light.
Among the impressionable young Germans who read Eberty and Bernstein was one named Albert Einstein."
The New YorkerThriley (talk) 21:39, 6 June 2024 (UTC).
The article is sufficiently long and new, has citations throughout, and appears to be written neutrally. I AGF on offline and German language sources. QPQ is done. There is some trouble in the references with a citation template, and then there's the matter of the hook. The hook says Eberty "inspired" Einstein, but the above quote does not verify that, only that Einstein read Eberty. – Muboshgu (talk) 19:00, 26 June 2024 (UTC)
Erdős–Moser equation
- ... that all solutions of the Erdős–Moser equation correspond to convergents of ln(2), yielding "one of very few instances where a large scale computation of a numerical constant has an application"?
- ALT1: ... that the only known solution to the Erdős–Moser equation is 1 + 2 = 3?
- Source: [15]
- Reviewed:
LucasBrown 11:35, 30 May 2024 (UTC).
- Pinging David Eppstein if he could contribute to the nomination (either as a reviewer or to suggest hooks) as the current hook seems very specialist or complex and thus may not be easily understood by general readership. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 00:54, 5 June 2024 (UTC)
- I'll also note that the article would be better with a bit more prose to contextualize what is going on here. Currently the article itself is very inaccessible to the average reader, it would be nice to have a background of why this equation is important (I see the term "Diophantine equation" being used, maybe you could include a few sentences on how this relates to the article) and some prose (as opposed to proofs) to convey the methods being used to solve it. Sohom (talk) 01:10, 5 June 2024 (UTC)
- According to our DYK rules, "Hooks should be likely to be perceived as unusual or intriguing by readers with no special knowledge or interest". I don't think that is the case for the proposed hook. Also, I think the hook is misleading: as far as we know, it could be the case that all solutions of the equation are the single solution 1+2=3, unrelated to the log(2) calculation. And calling this an "application" is dubious when it is just a mathematical calculation used to support another mathematical calculation. I have generally interpreted this rule as requiring that the hook connect the subject to some real-world topic beyond mathematics (just as we require that hooks about fiction connect the subject to some real-world topic beyond the plot). Unfortunately I see no non-mathematics at all in the article, on which to build a hook. It's kind of interesting to me that the known lower bound on a second solution is such a huge number, but I don't think I represent a general reader for this purpose. I do also agree that the walls of equations make the article hard to read (not just to the average reader), but that is not really a DYK criterion. —David Eppstein (talk) 01:22, 5 June 2024 (UTC)
- I'll also note that the article would be better with a bit more prose to contextualize what is going on here. Currently the article itself is very inaccessible to the average reader, it would be nice to have a background of why this equation is important (I see the term "Diophantine equation" being used, maybe you could include a few sentences on how this relates to the article) and some prose (as opposed to proofs) to convey the methods being used to solve it. Sohom (talk) 01:10, 5 June 2024 (UTC)
- To be honest, as a non-math guy, this hook is remarkably uninteresting. Though that is obviously my opinion, it shows that it is likely not a suitable one, or the article as a whole as a matter of a fact. TheBritinator (talk) 01:43, 5 June 2024 (UTC)
- How about "... that the only known solution for the Erdős–Moser equation is "1 + 2 = 3" ? DS (talk) 21:21, 5 June 2024 (UTC)
- I think it's better. It still doesn't relate to non-mathematics at all, but at least it's (1) at a level understandable to the general reader, and (2) kind of intriguing how something so basic-looking as 1+2=3 could be the basis of something where we don't know if there is another solution. The question is whether it's enough better to pass the interestingness test. —David Eppstein (talk) 21:27, 5 June 2024 (UTC)
- I also think that's better. I was going to suggest something like "... no one knows whether the Erdős–Moser equation has more than one solution". XOR'easter (talk) 22:12, 5 June 2024 (UTC)
- I have added the 1+2=3 hook to the list. - LucasBrown 04:07, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
- ALT1 is brilliant! Schwede66 04:00, 23 June 2024 (UTC)
- How about "... that the only known solution for the Erdős–Moser equation is "1 + 2 = 3" ? DS (talk) 21:21, 5 June 2024 (UTC)
- To be honest, as a non-math guy, this hook is remarkably uninteresting. Though that is obviously my opinion, it shows that it is likely not a suitable one, or the article as a whole as a matter of a fact. TheBritinator (talk) 01:43, 5 June 2024 (UTC)
Full review needed now that additional hooks have been suggested. Thanks. BlueMoonset (talk) 03:53, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
Articles created/expanded on June 2
David Fishwick
... that David Fishwick became the biggest minibus supplier in Britain after finding he could not afford a chip butty for lunch?Source: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/fame-fortune/like-big-banks-hate-do-nothing-help-public/- ALT1: ... that David Fishwick founded "Bank on Dave" after big banks abruptly stopped lending his customers money? Source: https://www.theguardian.com/money/2012/jul/06/bank-of-dave-small-business-finance-dave-fishwick
- ALT2: ... that David Fishwick presented the 2018 Channel 4 series How to Get Rich Quick? Source: https://www.irishtimes.com/culture/tv-radio-web/how-to-get-rich-quick-can-you-hear-it-ka-ching-1.3574894
- Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/Toro de fuego
Launchballer 12:01, 2 June 2024 (UTC).
- Will be reviewing this. 🌙Eclipse (talk) (contribs) 13:06, 2 June 2024 (UTC)
General: Article is new enough and long enough |
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Policy: Article is sourced, neutral, and free of copyright problems |
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Hook: Hook has been verified by provided inline citation |
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QPQ: Done. |
Overall: Good to go! 🌙Eclipse (talk) (contribs) 21:49, 2 June 2024 (UTC)
- I call false positive as that quote is fully attributed and therefore not a copyright violation.--Launchballer 22:19, 2 June 2024 (UTC)
- Approving ALT0. 🌙Eclipse (talk) (contribs) 22:32, 2 June 2024 (UTC)
pulled at request of nominator. theleekycauldron (talk • she/her) 22:04, 21 June 2024 (UTC)
- For context, The Times published a piece yesterday morning that directly contradicted my hook, which meant it wasn't accurate (he could afford a chip butty, just a slightly smaller one than usual). I also noticed that the Telegraph did not mention lunch, probably because it was in fact dinner. I will propose some more hooks later, but for now, I got severely carried away expanding the article, meaning that around only three eighths of this has actually been reviewed. This will definitely require a new reviewer. (Incidentally, that "Fighting Against the Elite" video is actually Creative Commons, so I have uploaded it to this nomination.)--Launchballer 20:04, 22 June 2024 (UTC)
- ALT3: ... that David Fishwick went from a £27.50 a week pebbledashing job to becoming the biggest minibus supplier in Britain?
- ALT4: ... that David Fishwick used to stuff his wallet with paper to appear richer to prospective sellers?
- ALT5: ... that David Fishwick married his wife after she told him his music was rubbish?
- ALT6: ... that David Fishwick decided he no longer wanted to be poor following an incident involving a chip butty?
- ALT7: ... that a Times reviewer of Channel 4's Bank of Dave opined that David Fishwick "could have been one of the best comedy characters of 2012"?
- ... and if "200 characters" wasn't a thing, I'd propose "that David Fishwick's How to Get Rich Quick "encourages people of modest means to pursue equally modest dreams in the very modest hopes, several weeks of hard work later, of doubling their modest investments"?.--Launchballer 10:15, 24 June 2024 (UTC)
- ALT8: ... that when a writer contacted David Fishwick to express interest in making a film about his bank, he insisted that it was shot in Burnley?--Launchballer 13:27, 28 June 2024 (UTC)
- For context, The Times published a piece yesterday morning that directly contradicted my hook, which meant it wasn't accurate (he could afford a chip butty, just a slightly smaller one than usual). I also noticed that the Telegraph did not mention lunch, probably because it was in fact dinner. I will propose some more hooks later, but for now, I got severely carried away expanding the article, meaning that around only three eighths of this has actually been reviewed. This will definitely require a new reviewer. (Incidentally, that "Fighting Against the Elite" video is actually Creative Commons, so I have uploaded it to this nomination.)--Launchballer 20:04, 22 June 2024 (UTC)
Articles created/expanded on June 3
Over the Hill with the Swords of a Thousand Men (The Boys episode)
- ... that writers for "Over the Hill with the Swords of a Thousand Men" researched the experiments of Nikola Tesla for the use of Stormfront's lightning in the episode?
- Reviewed:
TarheelBornBred (talk) 17:48, 6 June 2024 (UTC).
- Passerby comment (this is not a full review, feel free for others to take this nomination to review): to a reader without context not familiar with characters in the show, "Stormfront's lightning" will read weirdly, like a misspelled comment on the brightness of the Stormfront website. "Researched" is also a bit high-falutin', it's not like they actually did some physics research for the episode - the source quotes them as saying "we looked at Nikola Tesla". Maybe something like:
- ALT1: that writers for "Over the Hill with the Swords of a Thousand Men" were inspired by the experiments of Nikola Tesla for depicting a lightning attack in the episode?
- ALT2: that writers for the episode "Over the Hill with the Swords of a Thousand Men" were inspired by the experiments of Nikola Tesla for depicting a lightning attack used by the malicious superheroine Stormfront?
- ALT2 includes Stormfront still if desired, but clarifies that it's talking about a character not the website. SnowFire (talk) 03:37, 13 June 2024 (UTC)
Inauguration of Lai Ching-te
- ... that China launched a joint military exercise in response to Lai Ching-te's inauguration?
- Source: AP
- ALT1: ... that members of the Kuomintang refused to attend Lai Ching-te's inauguration after losing by 10 percent? Source: Radio Taiwan International
- Reviewed:
- Comment: First time here at DYK, please correct me if I make any mistakes, thanks!
'''[[User:CanonNi]]''' (talk • contribs) 06:14, 6 June 2024 (UTC).
- It looks like this meets the DYK requirements as far as length and timing. The sources look good. I'm not too familiar with Wikipedia's approach to this topic area, but have you reviewed Wikipedia:Manual of Style/China- and Chinese-related articles? I don't personally see any issues but I wanted to at least do my diligence. Once we figure that out, each hook should also add a little more context for the average reader, explaining a bit more of the who / where. Shooterwalker (talk) 20:24, 13 June 2024 (UTC)
- @CanonNi: Please address the above. Z1720 (talk) 15:26, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Z1720:, thanks for the ping. Honestly, I kinda forgot about this nomination... @Shooterwalker: thanks for the feedback. I've reviewed the MOS and think that the article and hook meet the guidlines and would be happy to fix any mistakes. About the context, I agree, so maybe we could change it to something like "...that China launched a military exercise in response to the inauguration of Lai Ching-te as president of Taiwan? '''[[User:CanonNi]]''' (talk • contribs) 10:09, 28 June 2024 (UTC)
- Let's go with the hook as you rewrote it:
- ALT1a: "... ...that China launched a military exercise in response to the inauguration of Lai Ching-te as president of Taiwan?".
- I don't see any other issues. Shooterwalker (talk) 23:20, 8 July 2024 (UTC)
Articles created/expanded on June 6
Breaking Through (2022 film)
- ... that in order to embody her acting role as a short-track speed skater in the movie Breaking Through, actress Meng Meiqi inserted a rock in one of her ice skates in order to feel real pain?
- ALT1: ... that the 2022 Chinese sports drama movie Breaking Through was shot in Northeast China at temperatures of −10 °C (14 °F)? Source: 《我心飞扬》曝海报 孟美岐领衔“四朵金花”冲金
- ALT2: ... that for her role as short-track speed skater in the movie Breaking Through, actress Meng Meiqi gained a weight of 15 kg (33 lb) in order to be closer in terms of physique of a short-track speed skater? Source: 《我心飞扬》曝海报 孟美岐领衔“四朵金花”冲金
- Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/Daniel Chapo
Toadboy123 (talk) 11:43, 6 June 2024 (UTC).
Full review is to follow (spot check seems to check out though for newness and length), but before the review continues, I would suggest that the article be given a copyedit. The first hook is probably the best option here. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 03:54, 24 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Narutolovehinata5: Sure. Do let me know what copyedit I should do for the article. Toadboy123 (talk) 18:49, 24 June 2024 (UTC)
- Both the Production and Pre-publicity and release sections are the ones in need of copyediting. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 23:12, 24 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Narutolovehinata5: So I have completed the copyedit on the stated sections. Do let me know how it is? Toadboy123 (talk) 13:27, 26 June 2024 (UTC)
- There are still multiple grammatical issues and weird wordings in the article, such as "Winter Olympic Games but lose opportunity to win the gold medal" and "In order to present the best effect of Olympic athlete." I'll see if I can ask another editor to give this a copyedit, either Bruxton or Launchballer. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 08:59, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
- I can take a look at this.--Launchballer 09:01, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
- I took out a number of clauses which were either tautologous or too nebulous to mean anything useful. I note that WP:UPSD highlights refs #6, #7, and #18 in yellow and wonder what makes them reliable, and I suggest that the single-sentence #Soundtrack section should either be expanded or merged.--Launchballer 06:41, 2 July 2024 (UTC)
- @Launchballer: So I have integrated the single line of 'Soundtrack' with 'Production and pre-publicity'. Are there any other aspects that needs to be rectified before the article can be all cleared for DYK? - Toadboy123 (talk) 18:51, 18 July 2024 (UTC)
- I've moved it to another part of the article, as single-sentence paragraphs are discouraged per WP:PARAGRAPH. I'll let Narutolovehinata5 complete the rest of the review, including sources.--Launchballer 19:40, 7 July 2024 (UTC)
- @Launchballer: So I have integrated the single line of 'Soundtrack' with 'Production and pre-publicity'. Are there any other aspects that needs to be rectified before the article can be all cleared for DYK? - Toadboy123 (talk) 18:51, 18 July 2024 (UTC)
- I took out a number of clauses which were either tautologous or too nebulous to mean anything useful. I note that WP:UPSD highlights refs #6, #7, and #18 in yellow and wonder what makes them reliable, and I suggest that the single-sentence #Soundtrack section should either be expanded or merged.--Launchballer 06:41, 2 July 2024 (UTC)
- I can take a look at this.--Launchballer 09:01, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
- There are still multiple grammatical issues and weird wordings in the article, such as "Winter Olympic Games but lose opportunity to win the gold medal" and "In order to present the best effect of Olympic athlete." I'll see if I can ask another editor to give this a copyedit, either Bruxton or Launchballer. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 08:59, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Narutolovehinata5: So I have completed the copyedit on the stated sections. Do let me know how it is? Toadboy123 (talk) 13:27, 26 June 2024 (UTC)
- Both the Production and Pre-publicity and release sections are the ones in need of copyediting. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 23:12, 24 June 2024 (UTC)
Article was new enough, long enough, and adequately sourced at the time of the nomination. Sources are all in Chinese so AGF. However, just to be sure I checked the article and the relevant sources and they all check out. A QPQ was provided; however it was a relatively incomplete reviewer that didn't explicitly check all criteria (for example bringing up the need for a QPQ or if the article was eligible), so I'm not sure if it is complete enough to count for a QPQ. I did not find any close paraphrasing. All of the hooks are cited inline, but the first hook (which is cited to an English source and mentions the hook fact) is probably the best option here. Apart from the QPQ, another minor issue is that the article is inconsistent with its date format: the article primarily use DMY, but some sentences use MDY. For consistency, the article has to stick to one or the other but not mix both. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 09:36, 8 July 2024 (UTC)
- @Launchballer and Narutolovehinata5: I have fixed the date issue by making sure all of the dates in the article are DMY. Do let me know now if the article is good to go. - Toadboy123 (talk) 05:43, 9 July 2024 (UTC)
- The issue for me now is the QPQ. I'll have to ask other editors like Schwede66, RoySmith, or SL93 if the provided QPQ is complete enough to count (because to me it seems uncomplete), or if a new QPQ will need to be provided. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 06:07, 9 July 2024 (UTC)
![](http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5c/Olympic_rings_without_rims.svg/50px-Olympic_rings_without_rims.svg.png)
Articles created/expanded on June 7
Scybalium fungiforme
- ... that the flowers of Scybalium fungiforme are covered in sharp scales that require opossums, with their opposable claws, to tear them open?
- Source: "Today, scientists have added another oddity to the list. Researchers had long suspected that because the female flowers of S. fungiforme are covered in hard scales that shield its nectar, it couldn't be pollinated by a bird or bee. And now, thanks to night vision cameras, scientists have their culprit: opossums." Shultz, David (12 February 2020). "Caught in the act: Opossums pollinate bizarre parasitic plant". Science. American Association for the Advancement of Science. doi:10.1126/science.abb2822. Retrieved 7 June 2024.
- Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/Esther Tailfeathers
- Comment: If there are any alternative wordings for the hook, I would be very much welcome to hear it! It is a very interesting plant that I believe would make a great hook. Thank you in advance to the reviewer for taking their time reading through this article!
Ornithoptera (talk) 21:06, 7 June 2024 (UTC).
- Starting Review--Kevmin § 17:02, 8 June 2024 (UTC)
Article new enough and long enough. The sections are all cited, and sources are all of good quality and neutrally represented. The description section is a little close to the translated source text and should be massaged into smoother flowing prose. As an alternative to hook, you could go with
- Alt1 ... that the primary pollinators of the parasitic Scybalium fungiforme plant (pictured) are saruê possums?--Kevmin § 16:30, 12 June 2024 (UTC)
- Hi @Kevmin:! Thank you for taking the time to read through the article,
and I will definitely take into account your suggestion in a moment(just reworded in accordance to your suggestion, if you have any more suggestions to help with the flow, you are welcome to share them!). I appreciate the alternative hook, but to me it feels a bit dry. I would like to emphasize in the hook how the flowers are torn open by possums. Matter of factly telling people that an animal pollinates plants (both of which they might not know) feel a bit dry to those who are not familiar with plant pollination. To folks who are familiar with pollination, knowing that mammals pollinate flowers is an uncommon pollination method and thus interesting, but its too niche to be hook-y to me. Including the idea that the flowers are essentially hidden away until they are torn open could be quite interesting to someone unfamiliar with the subject area. Ornithoptera (talk) 19:29, 12 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Ornithoptera: I can respect that. With the original hook, its long feeling, we should be looking to streamline it. None of the sources used so far have called the inflorescence scales "sharp", as a note. The Amorim et al 2020 paper specifically uses the terms "scrap and remove" and "desquamate" so maybe going with a peeling analogy. Also did you see there is a Dec 2002 paper also lead by Amorim which details bat visitation to the flowers doi:10.1002/ecy.3935 and documents two possum species and a second major scale removing group in the ruby-crowned tanager, Tachyphonus coronatus?--Kevmin § 20:21, 12 June 2024 (UTC)
- Alt2...that before they can be pollinated, flowers of Scybalium fungiforme need to be forcefully peeled open by possums or tanagers?
- @Kevmin: Hi! I did not! Fascinating resource though! It sounds like a much improved hook, and I didn't notice that article while I was doing my research! You are very much welcome to insert it into the article, but it sounds good to me! Ornithoptera (talk) 20:57, 12 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Kevmin: Hi! I haven't heard from you in a bit ever since I had replied last so I wanted to hear your thoughts on the matter and continue with the review? Ornithoptera (talk) 20:32, 1 July 2024 (UTC)
- Hi @Kevmin:! Thank you for taking the time to read through the article,
- Sorry about the lack of replies, Life got hectic with a burst water heater. If you want me to add the last source, I can do it, but that means adding me to the nom as a contributor and asking for a full review from an uninvolved editor. It would be easier for you to do an update to the article with paper #2 and I can then verify the alt hook and check the nom as good to go.--Kevmin § 16:54, 2 July 2024 (UTC)
- @Ornithoptera: which of these two options would you prefer to pursue?--Kevmin § 18:27, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
- @Kevmin: Hey, sorry, frankly I read the response in my head and forgot to respond entirely, my apologies. My sincerest apologies in regards to what's been going on in your life at the moment and thank you for taking the time out of your schedule to review the DYK nomination regardless. I hope it is resolved as soon as possible and hoping the best for you and anyone else who is affected. I will choose the easier option and update the article myself. Thank you for informing me that the option I had suggested would lead to that, I didn't know that would happen. I'll do my best to update the article later today and ping you once I have completed it! Ornithoptera (talk) 21:29, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
- @Ornithoptera: No worries, the larger life things resolved over the past week and I have more free time again (plus insidious temps outside so more reason to be inside writing :D ). Its in the subrules for DYK so may contributors don't know about it until the specific senarios present themselves. Basically as soon as a reviewer provides anything more then cosmetic edits to a nominated article they are considered a nominator and not a reviewer and thus a new review is needed with a non-nominator. I dont mind doing the update if you would like me too, mostly it will mean the nomination gets punted back and we wait for another reviewer to vet our combined work.--Kevmin § 22:58, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
- @Kevmin: Hey, sorry, frankly I read the response in my head and forgot to respond entirely, my apologies. My sincerest apologies in regards to what's been going on in your life at the moment and thank you for taking the time out of your schedule to review the DYK nomination regardless. I hope it is resolved as soon as possible and hoping the best for you and anyone else who is affected. I will choose the easier option and update the article myself. Thank you for informing me that the option I had suggested would lead to that, I didn't know that would happen. I'll do my best to update the article later today and ping you once I have completed it! Ornithoptera (talk) 21:29, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
Better Off Dead?
- ... that a reviewer called a documentary on assisted suicide "so funny"? Source: "What I wasn't expecting was for it to be quite so funny." Better Off Dead review – a powerful (and funny) case against assisted dying
- ALT0a: ... that a reviewer did not expect a documentary on assisted suicide to be so funny?
- ALT1: ... that a reviewer said that Better Off Dead? "unnerves you so much you half-wish you hadn't seen it"? Source: "Every so often, a documentary comes along that unnerves you so much you half-wish you hadn't seen it." The week in TV: Better Off Dead?; Bridgerton; The Gathering; The Big Cigar – review
- ALT2: ... that in Better Off Dead?, there is an automated hotline for assisted suicide? Source: "We hear the automated voice message on the 24-hour Maid hotline that those seeking to die can call." Better Off Dead? review – Liz Carr’s blistering film may well change your mind about assisted dying
- Reviewed: Grant Hermanns
Sdrqaz (talk) 03:12, 7 June 2024 (UTC).
no issues with the article. original hook is bad, taking a quote out of context. alt1 is boring. alt2 is confusing, and made me think that there was a hotline you could call in the documentary. ltbdl (talk) 02:07, 12 June 2024 (UTC)
- Rating this article as a Start seems ... pretty low (is it
"developing but still quite incomplete"
?). If I may be frank, this review is seems a little harsh. ALT0 was not taken out of context: the reviewer is saying that the documentary was funny, no (see the quote)? I don't know how to address the charge of ALT1 being boring (I thought that something being unnerving and making a reviewer regret watching was interesting), and as for ALT2, I don't really follow: I believe that they did call the hotline in the documentary. Sdrqaz (talk) 14:54, 12 June 2024 (UTC)- of course the review is harsh, this is going on the main page. as for alt2, the wording is unclear. perhaps say something like "they call an automated hotline"? ltbdl (talk) 16:35, 12 June 2024 (UTC)
- I've added ALT0a, which hopefully addresses the concern of
"original hook is bad, taking a quote out of context"
, given that it is the same formulation as the source. Sdrqaz (talk) 22:58, 19 June 2024 (UTC)- My 2c: I'd paraphrase so funny to hilarious instead of writing it in Wikipedia's voice; see MOS:QUOTEPOV. Nineteen Ninety-Four guy (talk) 12:16, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Nineteen Ninety-Four guy and Ltbdl: My interpretation of QUOTEPOV was that attribution was preferred in this instance as
"Concise opinions that are not overly emotive can often be reported with attribution instead of direct quotation"
(second paragraph). Sdrqaz (talk) 23:55, 25 June 2024 (UTC)- Right, which is why it should be directly attributed to The Times instead of referring to the publication as merely the reviewer, and so funny should neither be quoted nor written in Wiki's voice since it creates POV issues either way:
- ALT0b: ... that a reviewer did not expect a documentary on assisted suicide would be that hilarious?
- hilarious should be neutral enough with attribution to the source, IMO. Nineteen Ninety-Four guy (talk) 06:07, 26 June 2024 (UTC)
- @Nineteen Ninety-Four guy and Ltbdl: I don't understand how hilarious is more neutral than funny, given that funny seems like a
not overly emotive ... simple descriptive term
. I also do not think that it is necessary to mention which source that is in the hook, given that it goes against much of established practice – if you see theleekycauldron's essay (and its application of WP:WEASEL), the addition of "a reviewer" is already more than what is necessary. Sdrqaz (talk) 01:28, 4 July 2024 (UTC)- @Sdrqaz: Except the reviewer didn't just say funny but so funny, which is near-synonymous with hilarious; the latter can just be as neutral with proper attribution to the speaker. I concede to the "reviewer" bit, tho; I've slightly modified my alt suggestion to reflect this.Nineteen Ninety-Four guy (talk) 06:06, 4 July 2024 (UTC)
- @Nineteen Ninety-Four guy and Ltbdl: I don't understand how hilarious is more neutral than funny, given that funny seems like a
- Right, which is why it should be directly attributed to The Times instead of referring to the publication as merely the reviewer, and so funny should neither be quoted nor written in Wiki's voice since it creates POV issues either way:
- @Nineteen Ninety-Four guy and Ltbdl: My interpretation of QUOTEPOV was that attribution was preferred in this instance as
- My 2c: I'd paraphrase so funny to hilarious instead of writing it in Wikipedia's voice; see MOS:QUOTEPOV. Nineteen Ninety-Four guy (talk) 12:16, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
- I've added ALT0a, which hopefully addresses the concern of
- of course the review is harsh, this is going on the main page. as for alt2, the wording is unclear. perhaps say something like "they call an automated hotline"? ltbdl (talk) 16:35, 12 June 2024 (UTC)
- Rating this article as a Start seems ... pretty low (is it
Articles created/expanded on June 8
Reggie Brown (wide receiver, born 1970)
- ... that college football player Reggie Brown suffered an injury that causes "a lot of people [to] never even walk right again", but recovered in time for the next season and later made it to the NFL?
- Source: Alabama Journal (regarding injury) & Pro Football Reference (regarding NFL)
- Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/WUEC
BeanieFan11 (talk) 19:46, 15 June 2024 (UTC).
- Comment: since this seems to be something of a medical claim, the hook should be attributing correctly (Brown paraphrasing his doctor), if it's run at all. theleekycauldron (talk • she/her) 10:56, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
- Pinging BeanieFan11 - did you see Leeky's comment? ♠PMC♠ (talk) 10:33, 5 July 2024 (UTC)
- Sorry for missing it. @Theleekycauldron: So, something like this then? ALT1 ... that college football player Reggie Brown suffered an injury that his doctor said causes "a lot of people [to] never even walk right again", but recovered in time for the next season and later made it to the NFL? BeanieFan11 (talk) 15:24, 5 July 2024 (UTC)
- @BeanieFan11: His doctor didn't say it, Brown said his doctor said it. Which, if the doctor is alive, would arguably be an unreliable claim? theleekycauldron (talk • she/her) 18:35, 5 July 2024 (UTC)
- Are you saying that you think Brown or his doctor was incorrect? BeanieFan11 (talk) 18:51, 5 July 2024 (UTC)
- @BeanieFan11: His doctor didn't say it, Brown said his doctor said it. Which, if the doctor is alive, would arguably be an unreliable claim? theleekycauldron (talk • she/her) 18:35, 5 July 2024 (UTC)
- Sorry for missing it. @Theleekycauldron: So, something like this then? ALT1 ... that college football player Reggie Brown suffered an injury that his doctor said causes "a lot of people [to] never even walk right again", but recovered in time for the next season and later made it to the NFL? BeanieFan11 (talk) 15:24, 5 July 2024 (UTC)
- Pinging BeanieFan11 - did you see Leeky's comment? ♠PMC♠ (talk) 10:33, 5 July 2024 (UTC)
Articles created/expanded on June 9
Samuel Herbert Maw
- ... that the architect Samuel Herbert Maw is also well-known for his pictorial maps of Canada (example pictured)?
- Source: "Maw was also the author of a masterpiece of Canadian cartography, a bird’s-eye view of Quebec City, begun in 1926 and completed in 1932, in which he accurately rendered every single building in the Old Town and surrounding area, complete with a hand-drawn cartouche and historical notes on the significance of the buildings shown. Published by the Alexander Litho Co. Ltd. of Toronto, this map, measuring 27” x 35”, was reproduced in thousands of printed copies sold to tourists and visitors to Quebec for nearly three decades. A copy of the map can be found in National Map Collection, NAC, Ottawa. The popularity of this map led to another commission in 1939 for the Royal Tour of Canada. Entitled "This is Canada", it consisted of a full colour folio of maps of all nine provinces, printed in a spiral coil edition by The Macmillan Pub. Co. of Canada, and drawn by hand by S.H. Maw. The original folio was presented to King George VI & Queen Elizabeth by the Prime Minister of Canada. Just three years later, in 1942, he prepared an equally impressive Map of Montreal for the Tercentenary Celebrations of that city. It was placed on public display in the concourse of Windsor Station for several months. Yet another commission for a map was given to Maw in 1944 by the City of Ottawa, and he prepared a historical pictorial map of the Capital, unveiled at the National Gallery in Ottawa in 1944. This original map was later mounted on the north wall in the foyer of the Convention Hall in the Chateau Laurier Hotel."[1]
- Reviewed:
WikiFouf (talk) 16:33, 13 June 2024 (UTC).
- Very interesting. The article is long enough, it's new enough. It seems to be well-sourced, neutral, BLP-compliant, and copyvio-free. The other criteria seem to be met, except as follows: First, how is the image PD in the United States? And second, basically, I just have a quibble. The source certainly indicates his works were well known, but was he? The proposed hook does not make that clear.--Wehwalt (talk) 01:29, 18 June 2024 (UTC)
- Thanks @Wehwalt! Frankly, I know very little about licensing and have no idea how to figure out what the map's American licensing is. Is there a database to search through or something? Your other quibble is also fair, "well known" might be a stretch for the current context, if we're talking about him specifically. I do believe he was locally well known (or, at least, known) during his career, judging from the historical media coverage I've read. I found this obituary from the Ottawa Journal which I think shows he was notable in his field(s). So, maybe change "is" to "was", "well known" to "known", or both?--WikiFouf (talk) 16:19, 18 June 2024 (UTC)
- Notable has a meaning in wiki-talk, see WP:GNG for example. Maybe we could focus on the fact that his works had thousands of reproductions?
- As for the image, it was, under Canadian law at the time, protected for fifty years after death. Per this, however the copyright may have been extended per WP:URAA. This is not a field in which I am expert. Do you know if the maps were also published in the US at the same time?