Talk:Raphael, Nicholas, and Irene of Lesbos: Difference between revisions

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Line 13: ::: Well, since you seem to know much more about this than I do, why don't you move this page to [[List of newly revealed saints]], and compile all the info from the individual pages, which is well sourced (get rid of the garbage stuff). I think that would be the way to go, don't you? I'd do it, but I think you would do it better. [[User:onel5969\|'''<span style="color:#536895;">Onel</span><span style="color:#ffb300;">5969</span>''']] <sup>[[User talk:Onel5969\|<i style="color:blue">TT me</i>]]</sup> 13:46, 26 June 2018 (UTC) :::: I could do that, or just leave this article here and reword it, the only problem is that I still haven't found any better, reliable sources. It's one of those awkward situations where [[WP:V]] and [[WP:NOR]] are really difficult to fulfill: we can't just naively report stuff the way we find it in the existing sources, because those sources are quite obviously biased/unreliable/non-independet and their content is self-evidently implausible. We can't just point out why and how they are unreliable, because in the absence of better sources providing that analysis for us this would be OR. But we can't easily take the easy way out either, saying if there are no sources the whole topic must be non-notable, because the religious practices and beliefs in question are evidently wide-spread and relatively prominent. Whichever way you do it, it's never really satisfactory. [[User:Future Perfect at Sunrise\|Fut.Perf.]] [[User talk:Future Perfect at Sunrise\|☼]] 13:53, 26 June 2018 (UTC) :St Raphael was the Abbot of Karyes near the village of Thermi on the island. St Nicholas was a deacon at the monastery and St Irene was the 12-year-old daughter of the mayor of Thermi. The three saints were at the monastery with the village teacher and St Irene's father when the Turks raided it. :Sts. Raphael, Nicholas, and Irene of Lesvos are remembered by the Church in April on the first Tuesday after Orthodox Easter. :Saints Raphael, Nicholas & Irene of Lesvos :These saints were unknown for about 500 years after their martyrdoms during the Turkish occupation of Lesvos. In 1959 the three saints appeared to the people of Lesvos in dreams and visions. They guided excavations of their own graves, called people to repentance, and cured many kinds of diseases. :The saints revealed how they were cruelly tortured at the monastery, calling it a "second Golgotha" (in the words of St Raphael). St Raphael's torture ended when his head was sawn off. St Nicholas died of heart failure when he was being tortured and Irene was tortured in front of her father and burnt alive in a clay cask, where her charred bones were later found. The teacher's head was cut off and placed between his legs when he was buried. A great deal of blood was shed at the monastery; the saints were martyred for the sake of their Christian faith and fatherland. :During the Turkish invasion, on the 9th April 1463 a group of Christians went to St. Raphael's monastery to hide from the Turks' wrath. The Turks started to torture the saints and St. Irene's family in order to reveal where the other Christians were hiding. :The 12 year old daughter of the Community Chief, Irene, after having a hand cut off in front of her parents, was burnt to death in a large clay pot. Her parents were also murdered in a most inhumane way. :The Turks pulled St. Raphael by the hair with brute force. After they beat him savagely, the Turks hung him upside down and sawed his mouth and cut off his jaw. St. Nicholas was tied to a walnut tree and after seeing the horrific things done to St. Raphael, died of heart failure. :Afterwards, the saints appeared to many of the locals of Lesvos and, under St. Raphael's instruction, the relics were found, and a holy monastery 'Covenant for Ladies' now stands on the site. :Found amongst the excavation was St Raphael's round metallic engolpion with a low relief of 'Christ Pantocrator' on it. [[Special:Contributions/49.197.235.86\|49.197.235.86]] ([[User talk:49.197.235.86\|talk]]) 11:46, 6 June 2024 (UTC) I've tried a quick stab at removing the fallacious implication of historicity in the article here, and have redirected the three individual pages. This is still far from ideal, but probably the best we can do in the absence of any serious, independent sourcing on this religious phenomenon. [[User:Future Perfect at Sunrise\|Fut.Perf.]] [[User talk:Future Perfect at Sunrise\|☼]] 20:39, 2 July 2018 (UTC)